All creatures great and small
John R. Lott Jr. says, “With hunting season starting in various parts of the country, it may be time to acknowledge what vegetarians, as well as hunted animals, owe to hunters.” His argument: Hunted animals, if not lying around being dead, would otherwise be eating all the vegetables of the world. Anyone with a crotchety old grandfather who hunted deer from the edge of his garden (to keep them out of his corn and into his belly), knows what I’m talking about. If you need a refresher about the utilitarian benefits of hunting, you might enjoy his article. If, like me, you are familiar with these benefits, you might instead enjoy opening your deep freeze to feast on the fleshy bounty of creation.




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back to top26 Comments to “All creatures great and small”
All the vegetables of the world, Harrison?
In my experience, vegetarians tend to be much more concerned about the exploitation of animals than the [possibly] necessary killing of rabbits, rodents, and encroaching deer.
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I don’t think all the the fact that previous generations wiped out the natural predators, so now the deer overpopulate and starve for lack of food will change the mind of those deluded into thinking that it is cruel to kill an animal for food. To those I ask- which is more cruel, letting the animals starve or providing food for humans?
(I do agree that hunting for the sake of a trophy is uncalled for.)
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Mmmm… Venison.
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I’m interested to see if some of our materialist/evolutionist friends will argue that hunting is inherently wrong.
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As long as you eat it I don’t have a problem with hunting it. I don’t eat venison, therefore I don’t hunt deer.
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My brother and other sportsmen have their deer processed and then a local food bank receives a big load of venison.
Not sure if food pantry recipients turn it away or not.
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I could see hunting to extinction as wrong, but in general, not wrong. Most hunting is not to extinction.
Lott’s argument sounds kind of stupid to me. When’s the last time you saw elk or ducks eating your tomato plants?
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Frank, I suspect you would consider me a materialist/evolutionist for the sake of this discussion, and I don’t hunt. Not because I think it’s inherently wrong. Mostly because I don’t enjoy killing things, my family doesn’t “need” the meat, and my personal preference is for hunting with a 300mm lens. The animals look better in the photos if they are alive. Like Kim, I have no problem with food hunters. I do fish for food occasionally, so I may be considered a hunter in that regard.
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Sawgunner, I’ve always thought the term “sportsmen” was a funny name for hunters. I still do.
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Well, it takes more athleticism than bowling, doesn’t it, traipsing around the outdoors carrying a gun and hopefully a carcass?
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Sure, TRR, it’s like that for some. My family has a long tradition of hunting deer and elk for food. I just think the term is funny. It’s not like most hunters make it sporting match by dropping out of a tree onto the back of a bull elk with a knife held in their teeth. My brother-in-law considers himself a “sportsman,” but has never camped a night in his life, and has the build more associated with bowling. He and his father of similar athletic ability do like Dick Cheney, and stay in fancy lodges where they are taken out to shoot captive birds the “guides” release for them to shoot. The lodge employees clean and pack the birds for them to take home to their wives.
Last Thursday through Sunday I was over in a popular hunting area where there are what I consider the average hunters. It was raining much of the time. These hunters were driving slowly along Forest Service roads in 4wd pickup trucks, or drinking beer around the fire even though it was early in the morning. I suspect for some, not all, it’s an excuse to get out with their friends and drink a lot of beer, made all the enjoyable if something comes along that they can legally take
Who can blame them. It looks like fun. I have no doubt some venture off the road and away from the cooler. There was a Subaru wagon parked at a trailhead that accesses the Pacific Crest trail. Otherwise, all the hunting rigs were trolling, or sitting in campgrounds.
My uncle still hunts as you describe, and I know my dad used to when he was more physically able. On Saturday evening we talked with two men at the little grocery who had been successful. The younger one had gotten a 4-pointer. We talked awhile. They use motorcycles that they had on a trailer to get out and were going to go back the next day to haul out the meat. It was getting late.
sidenote: the reason we struck up a conversation was that one of the motorcycles was a Rokon. Very cool two wheel drive cycle. It has the ability to carry 5 gallons of extra fuel inside one wheel, and 5 gallons of water in the other. The wheels can also be filled with pressurized air so the bike can be floated across a river. Have a look. I’d love one.
http://www.rokon.com/products/trailbrkr.htm
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I suspect for some, not all, it’s an excuse to get out with their friends and drink a lot of beer, made all the enjoyable if something comes along that they can legally take.
Remember the song a fews years back about the “thirty point buck”?
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Hamachi,
A friend of mine used to have one of those Rokons, and I couldn’t remember the name of the silly thing. I was looking for it on the web for some reason and just couldn’t find it. Now if I could just remember why I needed to know. It may have come up here on the blog…
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MIM, that’s funny. Glad to be of use. Rokons are cool!
Peter, here is a link to that very funny song. It’s only funny because there is an element of truth to it!
mms://www.rangerrob.com/30point.wma
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From #4: I’m interested to see if some of our materialist/evolutionist friends will argue that hunting is inherently wrong.
Hunting is ok with me. Shoot deer or whatever all you want. Thinning the herd is sometimes necessary to control habitat destruction. Just please try to not shoot endangered species. Also, killing for fun instead of for food, does not sound like a good idea to me.
I recently lived near a private forest where hunting was not allowed. There was plenty of deer in that forest, but the coyotes kept their population under control. I knew the owners and they didn’t care if I enjoyed their forest. It was nice to walk thru that huge forest and not have to worry some hunter would think I was a deer.
Our evolved intelligence that made successful hunting possible is probably one of the reasons our branch on the tree of life didn’t die out.
The evolution of our larger brain may have been at least partly the result of natural selection for people who were successful at hunting food. The ancestors of modern humans, who did not have what it took to hunt successfully, were not likely to pass on their genes to the next generation. These are just my ideas I just thought of, so I welcome corrections or better ideas.
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I’m an evolutionary biologist and a hunter. your comments are stupid.
Hunting is no more ‘necessary’ for control of populations of game than is dropping birth control from a helicopter. I don’t care if you believe me or not, but I have a degree in Wildlife Science and I can assure you that the vegetables of the world do not survive because of hunting.
And I’m a hunter.
We hunt because we can. And because we have hunted for millions of years. And because my children will hunt like I have taught them.
Congrats!!! Just when you thought you had seen every microgram of stupidity World has to offer, you serve up some more hot steaming tard. I am grateful.
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We’ve missed you Erasmus. Seriously. Glad to see you here in the Afterblog.
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Good to see you Hamachi.
The new blog format has seriously dumbed down what used to be interesting. This post and the others preceding it are a good example of how much like plain rice soup the discourse within the fundagelical community is.
I wanna meet more science deniers!!! How can we meet science deniers here when you post b.s. about Fred Thompson wanting a stupid milkshake and some homeless kid making it to school every day? There ain’t even that much Jeeeeeeesus anymore.
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We’re rural and own some acreage – we have city people coming to hunt on our land and we have local people who hunt here. We don’t post our land, but we do appreciate it when people ask permission.
I don’t see hunting as a sport when the hunters want to put up a tree stand and go sit in the tree stand most of the day while the deer wander underneath and then they can shoot them.
I personally don’t care for venison but have had it prepared in such a way that it didn’t have that “gamey” taste and venison jerky is a nice treat now and then.
We’ve had some wild turkey that hunters have shared with us and that was good!
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BTW, you can say what you want about hunting — take it ot leave it — but it’s probably the most honest way to eat meat!
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This thread about hunting has gone on for how long with no mention of all of America’s most famous outdoorsman/bowhunter extrordinaire
(last name rhymes with pugent)???
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Agreed, Frank.
Sawgunner, I was a huge fan! That’s who I had in mind jumping out of a tree up above. Saw him live 27 years ago. His antics not too long ago were pretty pathetic though.
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Erasmus, Are they lulling us to sleep? For crying out loud, I’ve resorted to offering fall color pics to spice the place up!
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Nice avatar Frank!
And I have to agree with you as well about the most honest way to eat meat.
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VS,
A tremendous improvement over the old one, to be sure. (But are you even able to make out the design and motto?)
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A seagull caught in a frontload washing machine?
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