Personal Note: Struck down but not destroyed
We are “afflicted in every way, but not crushed,” Paul wrote to the church at Corinth, “perplexed, but not despairing; persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.” Over the past two weeks, I’ve written about two Christians who can relate to this passage of Scripture better than most. After completing a number of interviews, I wondered if I would have their courage.
I spoke with the wife of Ed Snell, the 69-year-old Pennsylvania pro-life clinic counselor who was hurled from the top of his car by an aborting father, suffering a bleeding brain injury that soon had doctors fighting for his life. Snell is recovering at home now. (Among secular media, only his hometown paper covered the attack, though it was widely reported on conservative blogs.)
And I spoke with Patte Smith, another pro-lifer who was attacked four months earlier. On August 29, 2007, Smith began speaking with a man and woman on their way into the notoriously “back alley” clinic of Orlando abortionist James Pendergraft. The woman was visibly pregnant and on her way to have a “labor and delivery” abortion (the kind in which the fetus is expelled into a toilet, sometimes alive.)
Introducing herself, Smith said to the couple, “If you wait just a few more months, you could go thru same process – labor and delivery – and you could have your baby and place it in a loving adoptive home.”
Smith said the man smiled at her in a “cold,” intimidating way, prompting her to retrieve a video camera from her car after he and the woman disappeared into the clinic. Smith said she had for years been advised by pro-life attorneys to keep a camera with her, for her own legal protection in case of violence or litigation.
“I usually don’t carry one, though,” she said. “I want to help women and babies, not discourage them from talking to me.”
This man’s attitude bothered her, though, so she got her camera. . .
Shortly thereafter, the man emerged from the clinic alone and after a trip to his car, returned to where Smith was standing, counseling another young woman. According to Smith, the man walked rapidly toward her and grabbed for her camera, repeatedly muttering, “Don’t film me, don’t film me….”
A witness, Mary Jo Gardner, said Smith turned to keep her camera away from the man, but he wrapped her arms around her. While trying to escape, Smith fell to the ground. Gardner screamed for help. Both Smith and Gardner said the man then bent over Smith, still struggling to get the camera. Then he kicked her in the ribs and went back inside the clinic.
Smith told me that wasn’t the first — or last — time she’d been attacked or threatened. Just a few weeks later, a man at the same clinic told Smith, “I’ll blow you away with my MAC-10.” She reported the threat to an Orlando policeman who was working paid security for the clinic. He told her, “Well, you shouldn’t have followed him to his car.” (The car was parked on a public street.) A crowd standing in front of the clinic laughed.
First, the attack in August — again, not the only attack, ever – and now a man had threatened to shoot her down in the street. And yet Smith still goes back to the Orlando Women’s Center every week.
She did report the August 29 attack and the Florida state attorney filed battery chargers against the assailant, Dr. Nelson Kraucak, a practitioner of family and holistic medicine. Still, Smith told me, “I was ashamed of myself for expecting any justice for a middle-aged woman who gets knocked down and kicked a few times. I wasn’t being murdered…like these poor little babies. The worst part of it was that there was nothing we could do to save these babies.”
The women with Kraucak and MAC-10 Man had their abortions just the same.
Listening to Smith’s story, I wondered if I would have her courage. After a man threatened to blow me away with a military-grade submachine gun, would I go back to the clinic? As American Christians, our notion of “struck down but not destroyed” is most often spiritual. We wrestle on our knees, not on public sidewalks. Would that I, if it came to that, be like Snell and Smith and have the guts to lay it on the line physicially, to be a modern-day Paul.




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back to top80 Comments to “Personal Note: Struck down but not destroyed”
Lynn,
You are not suppose to point out that there are violent folks on the looney left just like there are on the radical right. It will upset some people around here. You’re libel to get yourself cyber-assaulted. Watch your back.
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When the ones on the “right” have it as their full-time occupation to trail the ones on the “left” in the grocery, to the hairdresser, making intimidating noises, and yes, I know the person who did this, and then are beating their own wives and children, I am not surprised to hear of more violence.
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Lynn, thanks for bringing this to our attention.
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Reg,
You have to stop confessing, we are not Catholic priests
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I just love the way people defend illegal behavior by poointing out other illegal bahavior.
Sorry, this is bad logic and will never win a debate.
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4-
tell Lynn, too
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I am not defending anyone
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You’re not? Then… um… what are you doing?
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#4 – Good response!
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8-exposing abuse. It exists in many places and sometimes where we don’t expect to find it. IT is not enough to create straw men and take sides.
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Umm, sounds like reg is working off a stereotype?
Wonder if reg would justify such violence if it was directed at the ACT UP folks who disrupt Catholic services? Double standard?
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What? We’re not to take sides when abuse occurs? Which translation of the Bible are you reading this week, Reg?
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How would you know what I would or would not justify? I am not defending any violence.
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The “straw men” in question have bruised ribs and a brain hemorrhage. Does that matter?
But, I suppose they’re motivated by a hatred of women, or hatred of sex, or some other “Puritan” concern. Their assailants, OTOH, are motivated by love and compassion.
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I am saying that the anti-abortionist full-time workers that I know:
1) abuse their own spouse
2) as part of their occupation harass the abortionists
You never answered my question about how the Darby differs in meaning from the ASV in Malachi 2:16
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14-I am not talking about the ones mentioned in Lynn’s article. Why would you assume that I was?
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Because this is a series of comments posted in response to an article.
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Reg, I’m praying for you today.
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Reg, it does beg the question of relevance when you bring your personal experience into play with regard to this post. Look at it this way:
Post: Anti-abortion protesters were physically roughed up and intimidated by pro-abortion supporters, and the police (in one case) turned a blind eye.
Your response: I know anti-abortion protesters who do reprehensible things.
So either you’re trying to play the moral equivalency card, or say that the violence was justified (which you deny above). Or some third thing that I’m missing. Because “exposing abuse” seems to me like the same as drawing a parallel between the article and the abuse you’ve experienced.
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I think the only way you can be an effective sidewalk counselor at an abortion business is by the power of the Holy Spirit. God will give you the strength and wisdom you need to perform the tasks He has called you to do. If you don’t feel a strong tug AND a love for the people entering the abortuary and working there, sidewalk counseling is not a good ministry fit.
If you decide to picket an abortion clinic because you think the people inside are vile, nasty creatures who hate God and deserve to burn, you shouldn’t be there. Sure, their acts are despicable and full of sin, but they are still people made in the image of God, loved by Him and people with whom God desires to bestow love, forgiveness and a relationship.
Attitude is everything. And if sidewalk counseling is done without love, it is worthless and often causes more trouble for the workers truly called to a spiritually and physically dangerous front line ministry.
The perpetrators in this post may be terrible people–but they also may be reacting to a perceived threat because of the anger and hate-filled behavior of pro-life posters in the past. That does not excuse their attacks on Mr. Snell or Mrs. Smith, but it should be a warning and reminder to those of us who want to “do something,” without properly praying and consulting God on what we should be doing.
My prayers for recovery go to Mr. Snell and Mrs. Smith–but my prayers also go for those who beat them. Snell and Smith have their rewards in heaven–probably with more jewels in the crown now–but the future doesn’t look so good for those who hated and beat them unless Jesus touches their hearts.
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Well said, Michelle.
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20
thank you!
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First, the attack in August — again, not the only attack, ever – and now a man had threatened to shoot her down in the street. And yet Smith still goes back to the Orlando Women’s Center every week.
We thought Daniel was brave, yet he didn’t volunteer for the lions’ den!
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This is definately a situation where two wrongs don’t make a right. Or two “rights” make a wrong, I’m not sure. Is the most effective way to stop abortion to harass people going into a clinic. I know one woman who worked a a crisis pregnancy center. She told a woman she would adopt the baby if she would just carry it to term. She did and she did. There has to be a better way. I just don’t know what it is.
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Busybodies get what busybodies want.
Mind your own business.
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Kim,
I don’t see evidence that anyone is being “harassed” by volunteers here. Suggesting to someone visibly pregnant that an abortion now will be just as difficult as childbirth later, with the result of a dead baby now, isn’t harassment, it’s truth. There’s also no question the baby will feel pain at that gestational point; even “pro-choice” people get a little queasy on pregnancies that are that late.
I don’t see how perfect niceness (not saying anything that will bother someone) is necessary here. Yes, gentleness and compassion, but truly a life is at stake, and this woman is about to have an abortion that will haunt her forever if she has a conscience. How is it harassment to ask her to reconsider?
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Yes, just look the other way while 6 million Jews are slaughtered. Or Pol Pot kills millions. Or Saddam gasses entire villages. Or doctors dismember 42 million babies. Busybodies, I swear. We can’t be the world’s police, heck, we can’t even police our own or see the value in our children.
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“Smith said the man smiled at her in a “cold,” intimidating way, prompting her to retrieve a video camera from her car after he and the woman disappeared into the clinic.”
Smith confronts a couple during their private time of extreme medical need. The man’s response? He smiles and goes on. She interprets his smile as ‘cold’ and ‘intimidating’. She then chooses to up the level of confrontational because “this man’s attitude bothered her”. So you get a smile back, and so you run for your camera to protect you and further provoke him? That’s the best way to advance her cause and get the outcome she desires? Filming is supposed to change the heart of the man and woman? Where was Paul?
When she starts filming, he reacts in an expected manner. He tries to stop her by getting her camera. Equally, poor judgment on his side too. A tussle ensues and she ends up knocked down. If there was kicking or excessive force on his part that results in injury, that’s certainly uncalled for and perhaps punishable. Let the court decide. I’m sure there’s also his side of the story.
Patte Smith provoked this whole chain of events. She may have even acted in the manner in which she did knowing that it may produce this end result. She has her martyr status and is successfully generating publicity for both herself and her cause. Yeah, maybe she’s tough for going out there every day. Or maybe these incidents show that she’s ineffective at what she does and she might try another approach?
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Smith confronts a couple during their private time of extreme medical need.
I’m going to go out on a limb here and suggest that if Doctor Kraucak and the woman had been in “extreme medical need,” then Doctor Kraucak would’ve taken the woman to a hospital instead of a clinic that has been a revolving door for ambulances taking uterus-torn women to the hospital, as well as the subject of much negative reporting, even in secular media, about aborted babies born alive and left to drown or die from lack of care.
You write, “I’m sure there’s also his side of the story.”
I’m sure there is, too, which is why I called him twice to give him an opportunity to tell it. Dr. Kraucak did not return my calls.
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My point is…Did anyone offer to adopt this womans baby. We pro-lifers (and notice I said WE, which includes me) wring our hands and want to stop the slaughter of innocent babies. BUT do any of us offer to adopt or support that baby once it is here? Stopping abortion is only half the job. What are WE as Christians doing about the second part of the problem. Also because of the “noise” surrounding abortion, doctors and hospitals a leary of performing the therapeautic ones. When I finally became pregnant with Chloe my doctor told me I could choose “selective reduction” but he would not do it and the hospital would not allow it. He would have sent me to Birmingham. I am for looking for a better solution. An yes the media is slanted the other way.
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Was there a complaint, and charges?
The way things work in the U.S.A. if you don’t swear to information, you don’t get any sympathy. It’s hard to fault the police for their indifference. Lynn could write a story about why police don’t like abortion clinic protesters, and do things like keep them sitting under the sun with the ants.
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For the record. I most closely agree with Michelle on this issue.
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Yeah, maybe she’s tough for going out there every day. Or maybe these incidents show that she’s ineffective at what she does and she might try another approach?
Wow. You try to change the laws and get branded a religious bigot. Someone demonstrates peaceably and gets arrested. This gal tries the softsell, and is abused and kicked.
What other approach would there be Travis? Get a shotgun and prevent folks from going into the abortion mill? Perhaps that would be more effective…. [/sarcasm off]
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And NO I don’t advocate violence as a solution, but frustration with the “Everything you pro-life idiots do is wrong and makes it all worse” attitude, sure doesn’t ease the situation at all…
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“The woman was visibly pregnant and on her way to have a “labor and delivery” abortion”
Uh… isn’t late term abortion not allowed these days?
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Scroop writes: Was there a complaint, and charges?
In the Snell case, Nathan Scott Richardson is charged with assault and reckless endangerment.
In the Smith case, Kraucak is charged with battery.
In the case of MAC-10 Man, Smith complained to a policeman who was onsite at the time. He chastised her and laughed at her.
I guess two out of three ain’t bad.
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Uh… isn’t late term abortion not allowed these days?
Abortion is legal through all nine months of pregnancy, with exceptions in some states, such as Kansas.
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He chastised her and laughed at her.
Sorry, that should have said, “He chastised her, causing bystanders to laugh at her.”
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#28 “Shortly thereafter, the man emerged from the clinic alone and after a trip to his car, returned to where Smith was standing, counseling another young woman.”
Travis, Where does it say she was filming him?. (BTW if it was a video camera the correct term is “taping” not “filming”)
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Trust me, Kim, there are LOTS of people who would have adopted that baby. lOTSI
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Exactly KBells and that is the message we need to be giving these women. Someone, somewhere will love and take care of your baby, let me help you find them.
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Someone, somewhere will love and take care of your baby, let me help you find them.
That was part of Smith’s overall message. She has an information packet she gives out, and she follows through with those women who change their minds.
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Thanks for the follow up Lynn.
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Kim: I’m not sure about where you live, but here in Dubuque (and back in Roanoke, VA and Raleigh NC, where I lived before moving here), the prolifers are extremely busy providing care to pregnant women and to other mothers distraught about their pregnancies.
Tri-State Pregnancy Center here in my hometown helps with adoption services and buying supplies for mothers after the birth of their children.
The fact is, Christians are already doing by far the most to not only discourage women from aborting their babies but also provide care to them after they give birth.
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Adios (#1),
Was that an intentional misspelling? (”libel”)
IF so, clever one.
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Whenever I have heard of friends of friends considering abortions I have given them my phone number and said, “Tell your friend I will adopt their baby not questions asked.” It has happened at least six times. Three women have called me and I pleaded with them to let me love and care for their child. And I know others would would do the same.
Sadly I have never adopted because abortion was the easy solution for these women. I’m a big believer in put-up-or-shut-up. I was willing to commit to at least 18 years of emotional and financial responsibility, but the birth mother had to commit to nine months of . . . what . . . inconvience, akwardness? (None of the women I talked to were raped and none had parents who did not know they were with child).
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VINCENT: In the Smith case, Kraucak is charged with battery. In the case of MAC-10 Man, Smith complained to a policeman who was onsite at the time. He chastised her and laughed at her.
If the Kraucak case goes to trial, Smith will have to explain to the jury why she gets assaulted over and over again at the same place by different clinic patients. Is this a pattern, Ms. Smith?
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Adios thank you for walking the walk. That’s what I am talking about.
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Scroop,
While the court case for the battery charges will no doubt be a knock-down, drag-out fight in its own right, I can’t think of a single reason why “she had it coming” has ever been a reasonable defense of a physical assualt. It’s like saying a rape victim was asking for it.
It’d be one thing if Ms. Smith is the one initiating physical contact with the clients of the clinic; but the fault always lies with the person who lands the first punch.
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REG - 2
REG, if you have knowledge and proof that anyone is beating their wives and children, why are you not reporting this to the police department? Wouldn’t you want to protect them, especially the children?
What have you done?
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VINCENT:
These abortion clinic scuffles just aren’t Mississippi Burning for those of us who aren’t persuaded by your esoteric teachings and apocalyptic worldview. Sorry. Why don’t you put your wonderful imagination to use on something interesting, like the White House’s aborted e-mails?
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REG writes in Post 15
REG, you say you know of those who are anti-abortionist and full-time workers who “abuse their own spouse” – and you do nothing about it, do you call the police?
Do you have proof that these people……… ? ……… “as part of their occupation harass the abortionists”
Have you followed the anti-abortionist who are “full-time workers” who you say you know?
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Lynn,
There are many of us who support all you do, to make EVERYONE AWARE of abortion, and those who work to try and stop the killing, only to be harmed themselves.
Keep up the good work!
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My personal opinion is how could any woman see of sonogram of her baby and still terminate?
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Kim, their hearts are cold, its a selfish act!
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TRR,
The misspelling was unintended, but it worked. I’m dyslexic, what can I say?
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50, 52, Why would you assume that I did or did not report abuse? And WHY, pray tell, would I discuss that detail with you?
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REG,
If you are going to speak LOUD AND CLEAR, against those who you accuse of beating their children and wives, then it would only MAKE SENSE that someone would ask you if you reported it! OR, maybe you are making it up.
See your post below.
YOUR POST NUMBER 2 ……… “When the ones on the “right” have it as their full-time occupation to trail the ones on the “left” in the grocery, to the hairdresser, making intimidating noises, and yes, I know the person who did this, and then are beating their own wives and children, I am not surprised to hear of more violence.”
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I agree that Mr. Snell’s attacker should face appropriate criminal prosecution. Nevertheless, the article needs to get the facts straight.
Mr. Snell was “counseling” no one. He was standing atop a tower that he constructed on the roof of his car. He would park near a medical facility’s seven-foot-tall privacy fence, and shout over the fence from atop his tower at the clinic’s clients. Mr. Snell is not a counselor; he is a political protester.
But as a protester, he has elected not to direct his protest against the clinic or its professional staff. Instead, he directs it against the average folk who have made the difficult and private decision to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. In their moment of anguish, they must run the gauntlet through a line of bullhorn-wielding protesters who pepper them with taunts and jeers as they make their way into the facility.
Like Mr. Snell, we are all legally free to express our moral convictions in a manner that offends others and takes advantage of them at a moment of emotional weakness. But we shouldn’t expect a whole lot of public sympathy when we get bopped in the nose for being rude (even if the nose-bopping is a battery in the technical sense).
In any other context, such ungentlemanly conduct would not be condoned by this publication or its evangelical readers. The mere fact that we may share some of Mr. Snell’s opinions regarding abortion ought not to lead us to excuse his impropriety. He didn’t deserve to be battered. But neither does he deserve the admiration of the evangelical community.
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He didn’t deserve to be battered.
If he’s behaving in the manner you describe, maybe he does.
Whatever you may think about abortion, I would think that decent civil people would condemn the harassment the women have to endure from these “counselors.” I know people who volunteer to do clinic escort duty because the protestors are loud, confrontational and threatening.
The women are already scared, vulnerable and anguished. There’s no sign of Christian compassion in the actions of the protestors.
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#59
Kiyoshi,
Well, that explains how he got “hurled from the top of his car.” I was having trouble figuring out what he was doing up there to begin with.
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“…average folk who have made the difficult and private decision to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. In their moment of anguish, they must run the gauntlet through a line of bullhorn-wielding protesters who pepper them with taunts and jeers as they make their way into the facility.”
Cue the violins and award this entry “Most Heart-Rending Euphemism for Expedient Flushing of Baby Down Sink.”
By the way, ever been to a prolife demostration? I have, hung out with Operation Rescue over a three-day period. Taunts, jeers? No. Never. Prayer, silent marching, sign holding, singing, pleading? Yes.
Avoiding the spittle, obscenities, jabbing elbows, and foot grinding of the pro-abort cohort encircling and pressing against you (which, interestingly, includes heavy representation from Marxist and homosexual groups)? Yes.
“Sidewalk counselors,” which is what we’re talking about, aren’t protesters, per se. An effective sidewalk counselors is trying to accomplish an almost impossible act of persuasion within seconds or milliseconds. They must be both bold and ultra sensitive/intuitive. If you harass someone, they’ll just run into the building.
There is a fine Spirit-given art to communicating hope and God’s love towards mother and child before the unique life is extinguished forever.
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I’m sure telling women not to “flush their baby down the sink” is a very loving and effective way to get them to change their minds, Kwerna.
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Steveg,
Do you think we should be ’silent’ about those who do such things….as in your post 63?
Is there a loving way to tell women not to kill their children, or ‘flush’ them down the toilet?
What is loving about a child being thrown down any toilet or sink?
How soft and cuddly do you think we should talk, to those who have no more morals, than to toss a child on their way down to the sewer, through a pipe drain?
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V-
Like I said before, you should start your own website!
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Victoria: If you truly want to save the babies, you should talk as “soft and cuddly” as you need to in order to make the woman feel loved and cared for and get her to rethink her options.
Or you can feel all self-righteous and lecture her about what a vile sinner she is, and have her give you a well-deserved “Bug off” (although probably less polite) and go ahead with her plan.
Try swallowing your ever-present sense of indignation and see these women as scared human beings doing what they have reluctantly concluded is necessary. Then you might have a chance of changing a few minds.
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I’m sure Victoria talks much more “soft and cuddly” in real life than she does here on this blog when dealing with those who hate God and seek to ridicule her beliefs, SteveG. Heck, from the way you spew your hatred and ridicule on this site I wouldn’t want you as a neighbor either, but in real life I’ll bet you’re a pretty normal person. We all are, dude, so lighten up.
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Batteries in the “technical” sense are still batteries. Let’s face it, not everyone stands on top of his vehicle and expresses his morality, but people express them in this society all the time. Liberals bash conservatives in almost every television program condemning our values and inserting their sleazy ideas. If both sides were represented there, perhaps there wouldn’t be people standing on top of their vehicles. Ya never know.
Victoria doesn’t have to speak “soft and cuddly” here — what kind of people are you that you don’t address the idea of expelling a child into a toilet? That’s pretty disgusting, and I would think it would be disgusting even to someone who favors abortion.
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Oh, and they’re not all “scared.” The vast majority of abortions are done for convenience. That ain’t fright.
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Outkast at #67: Please cite an example of the “hatred” I supposedly “spew.”
I think I engage people with respect on this blog even when I strongly disagree. I admit to having a little sarcasm now and then, but it’s all about ideas, not people.
However, I categorically deny any hate. I do not “hate God” for one thing, no matter how strongly I disagree with what some people believe about God.
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NJLawyer at #68:
Victoria doesn’t have to speak “soft and cuddly” here
I agree. But her question was How soft and cuddly do you think we should talk, to those who have no more morals, than to toss a child on their way down to the sewer, through a pipe drain?
That’s not a question about what she says here, it’s about what people should say to women considering having an abortion. I say, most of the time those women feel trapped and scared already. How useful is it to add harsh and angry words from the “loving Christians” who want her to change her mind?
(I don’t know where you get your information that “most” abortions are done for convenience. But in any event, I’m talking about those women who are not.)
— what kind of people are you that you don’t address the idea of expelling a child into a toilet? That’s pretty disgusting, and I would think it would be disgusting even to someone who favors abortion.
And how do you conclude that it’s not? I find that idea as repellent as you do and I’m not defending it. But the protestors at clinics don’t reserve their venom for the late-term pregnancies.
Like it or not, abortion is legal. People who seriously want to end abortion should be working to change the law AND should be supporting efforts to reduce unwanted pregnancies in the first place. Screaming at women who are already terrified may scare some of them away, and no doubt makes the busybodies happy, but it doesn’t really solve anything.
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My statement above stands on its own merits. SteveG. I don’t have to prove anything.
Don’t worry — we all know about you, and it’s okay.
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Ha! I love it when people say “we know about you” as if you’ve figured out some great secret.
Does it make you feel important?
I am pretty transparent.
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Nothing makes me feel important, SteveG, because I know that I am nothing. God is EVERYTHING in my life, and all I have in life I owe to Him. Apart from God, I am nothing and can do nothing.
When I said “we know about you,” it means that the Christians here know that you’re just like us — a sinner in need of a Saviour. You can’t win salvation through anything you do in this life either, because it’s a gift of God.
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REG – 65
Yes you have said this before. If you don’t like my posts, SKIP THEM! You aren’t required to read anything I write.
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STEVEG – 71
YOU WRITE …..“That’s not a question about what she says here, it’s about what people should say to women considering having an abortion. I say, most of the time those women feel trapped and scared already. How useful is it to add harsh and angry words from the “loving Christians” who want her to change her mind?”…..
Steveg, talking to someone who is considering an abortion is very different from listening to someone talk about seeing a child in a toilet-
I wouldn’t think of trying to persuade anyone from an abortion by yelling at them.
You might be surprised Steveg, not all women are terrified of abortion, what they are upset about is the pain it might cause them, not the childs pain, or the life that little one will never get to live by their selfish act.
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I wouldn’t be surprised, no. I know a few women who have had abortions and more who considered it but decided not to.
I have known a few like you describe, who just want to get out of a situation and go on with their lives and don’t seem overly bothered by it. I admit they exist. But I know at least twice as many who either had abortions or at least considered it for much more desperate reasons.
I figure it’s not my place to judge, just to offer what help and support I can.
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Steveg
Have you worked in pro-life? Is your experience with abortion connected to personal friends, or is it with an abortion facility or one of the organizations which help pregnant girls/women?
I ask these questions, because you have a lot of answers, for someone who has never told us what you do in this area, what your experience really is. Would you mind answering?
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I’ve never worked in any thing related to abortion, on either side. I’ve not been a volunteer or an activist or a staff member.
However, I have followed the issue for many years (it’s inescapable in American politics) and I’ve known people who have had their own experiences.
I don’t claim to have answers. I believe that the pro-life side is far too quick to assume that women who have abortions are just selfish and monstrous. I believe that the pro-choice side is too quick to assume that people who oppose abortion have ulterior motives.
I believe we’d get a lot farther down the road to some sort of solution if everybody would just shut up with the slogans and the shouting and actually TALK to each other.
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Steveg
Talking has been going on before abortion became law. If you haven’t been involved ‘first hand’ you don’t know what goes on, you haven’t a clue. I don’t say this to insult you, but its the truth.
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