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	<title>Comments on: Whirled Views 2.9</title>
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		<title>By: NJLawyer</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272363</link>
		<dc:creator>NJLawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:29:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I don&#039;t know too much about this, Jon Rowe, but your basic premise makes a lot of sense -- that &quot;political liberty emerged from religious disputes in Western Civilization.&quot;  Our early settlers certainly came here for freedom of religion, which is also freedom of thought. We get that phrase &quot;separation of church and state&quot; from Jefferson&#039;s letter, but I doubt he&#039;s the first one to come up with the idea.  Is that where these Unitarians come in?

(I think Cheryl&#039;s right that it was an experiment. I think that doctor was testing nature v. nurture.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know too much about this, Jon Rowe, but your basic premise makes a lot of sense &#8212; that &#8220;political liberty emerged from religious disputes in Western Civilization.&#8221;  Our early settlers certainly came here for freedom of religion, which is also freedom of thought. We get that phrase &#8220;separation of church and state&#8221; from Jefferson&#8217;s letter, but I doubt he&#8217;s the first one to come up with the idea.  Is that where these Unitarians come in?</p>
<p>(I think Cheryl&#8217;s right that it was an experiment. I think that doctor was testing nature v. nurture.)
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		<title>By: Cheryl D.</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272313</link>
		<dc:creator>Cheryl D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 03:55:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Victoria,

Yes, it was a botched surgery...but the &lt;i&gt;experiment&lt;/i&gt; part was to raise him as a little girl rather than as a boy. So they dressed him in dresses, gave him a girl&#039;s name, gave him dolls...all under the &quot;loving&quot; direction of a scientist who had been looking for a child to experiment on. And the experiment kept being reported as a success, though the parents noted that privately they noticed that their &quot;daughter&quot; was more masculine than their (unmutilated) son.

When he was told the truth as a teenager, he immediately chose to return to boyhood, always having had a sense he wasn&#039;t a girl. I may be wrong, but I believe that one of the twins killed himself and one died very young of natural causes, but likely related to this whole sordid mess. I&#039;m pretty sure both are dead now, but couldn&#039;t swear to it.

I daresay this is an experiment of the same kind, and likely to bring similar tragedy to the family that would dare do such a thing to a child. Yes, he probably &quot;wants to be a girl,&quot; but he isn&#039;t, and pretending he is will not solve the problems he&#039;s experiencing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Victoria,</p>
<p>Yes, it was a botched surgery&#8230;but the <i>experiment</i> part was to raise him as a little girl rather than as a boy. So they dressed him in dresses, gave him a girl&#8217;s name, gave him dolls&#8230;all under the &#8220;loving&#8221; direction of a scientist who had been looking for a child to experiment on. And the experiment kept being reported as a success, though the parents noted that privately they noticed that their &#8220;daughter&#8221; was more masculine than their (unmutilated) son.</p>
<p>When he was told the truth as a teenager, he immediately chose to return to boyhood, always having had a sense he wasn&#8217;t a girl. I may be wrong, but I believe that one of the twins killed himself and one died very young of natural causes, but likely related to this whole sordid mess. I&#8217;m pretty sure both are dead now, but couldn&#8217;t swear to it.</p>
<p>I daresay this is an experiment of the same kind, and likely to bring similar tragedy to the family that would dare do such a thing to a child. Yes, he probably &#8220;wants to be a girl,&#8221; but he isn&#8217;t, and pretending he is will not solve the problems he&#8217;s experiencing.
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		<title>By: Jon Rowe</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272234</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Rowe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:42:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Friends,

I&#039;m working on a piece for in print publication, the thesis of which I will briefly detail for feedback.  The concept of political liberty emerged from religious disputes in Western Civilization and it was religious dissidents who first articulated these notions.  It was out of the experience of mistreatment that religious dissidents began to demand first toleration and then liberty.

Because &quot;Protestantism&quot; was a dissident movement, Protestant thinkers played key roles in establishing liberty.  And unitarians -- those who believed in what orthodox Trinitarians consider soul damning heresies of Arianism and Socinianism -- were the ultimate dissident Protestants and as such played key roles in influencing political liberty and the American Founding.  My article focuses chiefly on these unitarian heretic ministers (though some of these figures weren&#039;t ministers) who were instrumental in advancing the cause of liberty.  They include, Joseph Priestley, Richard Price, John Locke, Isaac Newton, John Milton, Samuel Clarke, Jonathan Mayhew, Charles Chauncy, Samuel West, and a few others.  All of those names were Arians or Socinians (unitarians).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Friends,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m working on a piece for in print publication, the thesis of which I will briefly detail for feedback.  The concept of political liberty emerged from religious disputes in Western Civilization and it was religious dissidents who first articulated these notions.  It was out of the experience of mistreatment that religious dissidents began to demand first toleration and then liberty.</p>
<p>Because &#8220;Protestantism&#8221; was a dissident movement, Protestant thinkers played key roles in establishing liberty.  And unitarians &#8212; those who believed in what orthodox Trinitarians consider soul damning heresies of Arianism and Socinianism &#8212; were the ultimate dissident Protestants and as such played key roles in influencing political liberty and the American Founding.  My article focuses chiefly on these unitarian heretic ministers (though some of these figures weren&#8217;t ministers) who were instrumental in advancing the cause of liberty.  They include, Joseph Priestley, Richard Price, John Locke, Isaac Newton, John Milton, Samuel Clarke, Jonathan Mayhew, Charles Chauncy, Samuel West, and a few others.  All of those names were Arians or Socinians (unitarians).
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		<title>By: mumsee</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272217</link>
		<dc:creator>mumsee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 17:52:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I knew those things were in there! Good job girls!  And to think, I knew all four of them but could not bring them together.  It must say something about my mind but I don&#039;t think I want to know.

Ajisuun, 

It is much easier to read your blog than to comment, you might warn people as an encouragement to keep trying!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I knew those things were in there! Good job girls!  And to think, I knew all four of them but could not bring them together.  It must say something about my mind but I don&#8217;t think I want to know.</p>
<p>Ajisuun, </p>
<p>It is much easier to read your blog than to comment, you might warn people as an encouragement to keep trying!
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		<title>By: Karen O</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272215</link>
		<dc:creator>Karen O</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 17:45:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>How about these-

&quot;Opposites attract.&quot;

&quot;Birds of a feather flock together.&quot;

Ajisuun -

Just today I read your comment on the Surprises thread about being asked to be your niece&#039;s maid-of-honor.

When I got married, almost 22 yrs, ago, I asked my 58-yr.-old aunt to be one of my bridesmaids cuz she is such a special lady.

Yesterday, at a Ladies&#039; Lunch at church, an 88 yr.-old woman said she had been asked to be her niece&#039;s (grandniece, I believe) matron-of-honor.  Isn&#039;t that beautiful?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about these-</p>
<p>&#8220;Opposites attract.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Birds of a feather flock together.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ajisuun -</p>
<p>Just today I read your comment on the Surprises thread about being asked to be your niece&#8217;s maid-of-honor.</p>
<p>When I got married, almost 22 yrs, ago, I asked my 58-yr.-old aunt to be one of my bridesmaids cuz she is such a special lady.</p>
<p>Yesterday, at a Ladies&#8217; Lunch at church, an 88 yr.-old woman said she had been asked to be her niece&#8217;s (grandniece, I believe) matron-of-honor.  Isn&#8217;t that beautiful?
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		<title>By: Ajisuun</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272213</link>
		<dc:creator>Ajisuun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 16:57:35 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>These aren&#039;t all that profound, but consider these

1.  Absence makes the heart grow fonder.

2. Out of sight, out of mind.

Huh?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>These aren&#8217;t all that profound, but consider these</p>
<p>1.  Absence makes the heart grow fonder.</p>
<p>2. Out of sight, out of mind.</p>
<p>Huh?
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		<title>By: mumsee</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272208</link>
		<dc:creator>mumsee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 16:26:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>As far as the dueling quotes, I have not yet thought of any but I am still trying.  I can think of quotes but not conflicting ones. They have to be in here somewhere, I will keep looking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As far as the dueling quotes, I have not yet thought of any but I am still trying.  I can think of quotes but not conflicting ones. They have to be in here somewhere, I will keep looking.
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		<title>By: mumsee</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272207</link>
		<dc:creator>mumsee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 16:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>karen O,

Except that I did not even get the opportunity to click!  I think there is an underweb sending messages from computer to computer, warning the gaining computer what is about to happen so they can do sly things to the unsuspecting. It is a vast internet conspiracy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>karen O,</p>
<p>Except that I did not even get the opportunity to click!  I think there is an underweb sending messages from computer to computer, warning the gaining computer what is about to happen so they can do sly things to the unsuspecting. It is a vast internet conspiracy.
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		<title>By: Karen O</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272202</link>
		<dc:creator>Karen O</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 14:48:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Mumsee - Kinda sounds like a secret way to enter, like &quot;Click twice &amp; tell them Joe sent ya.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mumsee &#8211; Kinda sounds like a secret way to enter, like &#8220;Click twice &amp; tell them Joe sent ya.&#8221;
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		<title>By: mumsee</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/02/09/whirled-views-29-2/comment-page-1/#comment-272174</link>
		<dc:creator>mumsee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 07:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Mickey,

I have no idea what happened, but when Cameron suggested I go back and try double clicking, it let me in with no question of passwords or user names.  I was able to read several items without a problem.  Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mickey,</p>
<p>I have no idea what happened, but when Cameron suggested I go back and try double clicking, it let me in with no question of passwords or user names.  I was able to read several items without a problem.  Thanks!
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