I have no problem calling slavery generally wrong, because it is almost always associated with cruelty and oppression. The fact that the Bible does not condemn it stronger is irrelevant. Slavery is not always cruel and oppressive, and ancient slavery was mostly a consequence of war, so the real issue is war, not slavery. Besides, there is plenty of sin already clearly delineated to condemn me. I am not looking to heap more sin on other people’s heads.

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We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

Paul was imprisoned after helping a slave in Acts 16:19 (close to my personal reference in 17:1!). Note how the master is portrayed.

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In what way is this verse in referrence to slavery?

Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme. 1 Timothy 1:20

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We all have different experiences in which we base our beliefs, coupled with education. The Civil War, is one area that many do not agree on, its a subject that still causes pain.

I have purposely refrained from posting on this thread, as I was ‘reported’ regarding my comments.

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Regarding the slavery tangent, 1 Timothy 1:20 lumps slave traders in with adulterers, murderers, and perverts. The Bible absolutely does call slave trading sin.

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actually it is my understanding that the 3/5 was acutally a number used for adminsitration purposes already in the colonies. And indeed it was a compromise.

But an interesting compromise which had long term consequences, since it increased the southern political influence based on individuals who were not enfranchised. This skewing of political power was at least part of what I sense drove the civil war, and indeed with your comments on state rights, you wold appear to at least partially agree.

I tried very hard to make a fair list. My sense is that there were a series fo collateral issue and forces which were a cause of tensions between the states, and a reasonable argument can be made that these tensions could only be resolved by war, unfortunate as that may be.

My real intent is to point out that a looking backwards, and assigning blame on either side, probably does not help in focusing on looking towards the future, especially given the large amount of mixing which is occurring in the U.S..

Even were we to make an iron clad case that a specific region was culpable in some way, the heavy inmigration to all regions makes this issue moot.

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Looking at the whole list, I can see you aren’t saying all of these are the South’s fault (as certainly reconstruction was not). But many people blame Southern racism for the three-fifths idea, and that one wasn’t Southerners at all.

Your list is fair.

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I’m “on deadline,” so I’ll only respond to one of your points. The 3/5 of a person was not a Southern idea. It was to keep Southerners from having extra people for census purposes because of slaves. Think of the electoral college and the Congress, for instance–they’re apportioned by the number of people. If you have slaves, you thus get more votes. So the three-fifths of a person worked against the South and was a compromise to give the South less power; it wasn’t Southern racism.

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I’m sorry you have been getting so many complaints about me. I have found many posts to be unfair, untrue or rude, however, unless someone uses profanity or makes a blatant remark against me personally, I wouldn’t be interested in ‘turning them in’ or complaining about their posts.

I don’t agree with you, because this has happened many times in the past with misquotes, etc ….. the real solution to this problem is that I don’t post to Cheryl any longer, as this problem won’t resolve itself by further contact. This should take care of the problem, and alleviate any further distress.

Sincerely,

Victoria

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