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Muslims outraged over ad
A Scottish police force is apologizing after Muslims expressed outrage over an advertisement that featured a puppy–an animal Muslims consider ritually unclean. The postcard, which was mailed to the community to announce Tayside Police’s new non-emergency telephone number, pictured Rebel, a police dog-in-training, sitting in a policeman’s hat.
A spokesman for Tayside Police said: ‘Trainee police dog Rebel has proved extremely popular with children and adults since being introduced to the public, aged six weeks old, as Tayside Police’s newest canine recruit.
‘His incredible world-wide popularity – he has attracted record visitor numbers to our website – led us to believe Rebel could play a starring role in the promotion of our non-emergency number.
‘We did not seek advice from the force’s diversity adviser prior to publishing and distributing the postcards. That was an oversight and we apologise for any offence caused.’
But should the police force even need to apologize?
back to top96 Comments to “Muslims outraged over ad”
I am dismayed that the police apologized! Tell the Muslims to get over it or go back to the desert!
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You do not have the right to never be offended.
It’s a PICTURE for crying out loud!
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I saw this in the news yesterday. The puppy, Rebel, has quite a following because he’s cute. The picture is absolutely adorable!
If they don’t like the fact that “we” in the west like dogs, they should stay home in their own countries. I fail to see why everyone in the West feels this need to adjust to them and apologize to them. They don’t like pigs either. Does that mean we can’t have piggy banks anymore?
A few weeks ago, there was another article that a muslim group in Scotland wants to take over a town and set up sharia law there.
The Scots should grow a spine.
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I read the comments on the article. It sounds like the British have about had it with these folks.
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lol from the comments
i am outraged that they are outraged.
hold on now, WOW repeated this nonsense. isn’t this a poor choice of words? outraged? just like the atheist outrage? when are we going to see “Fundies outraged over other people’s lives”? or is it just folks that you don’t like that get ‘outraged’?
I’m outraged at WOW.
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Muslims outraged?
Must be a mistake.
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And now I’m all outraged at your post Eraamus. I’m glad we live in a country that we are free to be outraged and free to outrage.
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NJL: I agree, or as the bible says, they should gerd up their loins and act like men.
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That would be gird!
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I’m outraged at myself for making another mistake. I sure agree, KBELLS #7. What a blessing!
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Since hordes of Islamic people are illegally moving into (formerly) Christian Europe isn’t the onus on them to assimilate?
Unless of course Islamic people are not interested in assimilating but rather getting others to conform to them.
The joys of diversity and multiculturalism.
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Too bad William Wallace isn’t around anymore.
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The religion of Islam requires all Muslims to make sure that the country where they live is eventually an Islamic one and that all the people who live there are eventually converted to Islam. This what the Islamic terrorists have been telling us and have been dying for all over the world in the 20 odd wars they have started and are fighting today. It is just a matter of time for them and having a high enough birth rate.
It is time we believe what they have been telling us.
I see Make It Man read the bill of rights written by the fine congressman from GA. Correct. Americans do not have the right to never be offended – but Muslims obviously do and the Scots agree with them. We are becoming a band of fearful woosies afraid of our own shadows.
Fear always leads to failure.
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Outrage over a puppy? Scotland is going to the dogs!
DISCLAIMER: (Please do not construe that cliché as a slam on Muslims. It is a joke and should be taken with a grain of salt. Of course, should I make sure salt does not offend any of our WMBers before submitting this comment?)
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I think we all know exactly why the police apologized.
It’s not because they offended someone. It’s because of WHO they offended.
Let’s be honest, if some other religious or ethnic group were offended by the mere photo of an animal, the police would laugh it off. But not every group blows up people and sets buildings on fire in a display of outrage.
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Just looked at the ad:
That dog is the Devil. Look at its face.
Heck, I’m outraged now.
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Well I’m offended, they’re offended, you’re offended, he’s offended, and she’s offended too.
My dog is offended too! He can’t believe that
dog-o-phobia is so widespread in the Muslim community. He wants to know when Europe will speak up for his rights. He wants to know why PETA is so silent, while such injustice continues. He also wants to know how they feel about cats, or is it just dogs and pigs that they hate? I don’t know what to tell him. He’s beside himself. I’ll get him a treat to help ease the pain these bigots have inflicted on him.
How can you be offended by such a cute wittle puppy dog? I wanna kiss him. Would that make me an unclean infidel, or just an infidel?
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When people can’t even send out a postcard with a picture of a puppy, then the terrorists have already won. They won’t even need bombs anymore.
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I just had a crazy thought.
Instead of fighting Islamic people in obscure Baghdad neighborhoods and in the mountains of Afghanistan why not secure our borders to keep them from immigrating?
At a tiny fraction of the cost of those insane wars.
But of course that kind of logic seems to elude Bush.
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Seems more and more like Muslims in the West are treated by everyone else like the crazy guy in the neighborhood that you don’t wanna piss off because everyone pretty much knows he has a closet full of guns he inherited from his WWII-vet uncle.
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They invaded the western culture. The culture doesn’t have to accommodate them. Next, they will be outraged at Porky Pig (Is he still around?) and Mickey Mouse.
But I’m outraged that KBells is outraged at Erasmus for being outraged that they could be outraged over a puppy.
Soon, you can never walk your dog is Scotland, somebody may be outraged.
I’m outraged every time I have to select English at an ATM, or other machine.
I don’t think the Star Spangled Banner is a good national anthem, but I’m outraged when someone refuses to sing it.
I’m also outraged that the Scots apologized.
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Actually, it isn’t funny. Llama is correct. We should start believeing what they tell us. Do not believe diplomatic talks will solve these problems.
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The Scots, a normally sensible people, have gone to the dogs by actually paying someone to be a “diversity officer.” Diversity has become the central tenet of the secular-religious fundamentalists.
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This is totally George Bush’s fault.
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From an unreleased episode of Star Trek–
Captain’s log, Star Date 5091.3. Orbiting over Earth for some R & R. Just got this message from my Chief Engineering Officer Scott, who has been visiting his mother in Edinburgh: “Beam me up, Captain. There is no intelligent life here in Scotland anymore.”
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Peter Leavitt beat me to it. It suddenly occurred to me, and I had to come back to say it:
I am outraged at the need for a “diversity adviser”.
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Please let’s not limit our outrage to Scotland.
Every white Christian country in the world is in the same boat.
It is our job to come to some sort of accord with our uninvited guests. The immigrants are using the same tactic (first perfected by blacks) to accuse people they disagree with of racism, sexism, xenophobia, anti-Semitism etc.
Their strategy is simple: the best defense is a good offense. As long as white Christians are put in the position of apologizing, appeasing etc. others perhaps we won’t notice what failures other societies have been.
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Chas (21): Next, they will be outraged at Porky Pig (Is he still around?) and Mickey Mouse.
Frank: Yes, Porky Pig is still around — and fighting the good fight, I might add:
http://tinyurl.com/4tw23s
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I’m surprised the police departement apologized and disappointed — there is was no reason for them to do so –
I know that the Muslims hate dogs, I’ve heard them say it here where we live. They make a big deal out of dogs being near them.
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Remember what happened about a year ago in France?
The French took it upon themselves to feed a group of homeless Islamic people.
The Islamic people complained because there was pork in the soup.
P.S. Islamic people don’t like to be around dogs?
It makes perfect sense. We all know how hygenic Islamic people are.
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Nick
Your Post 30 ps is beyond the bounds of decency and is bigotted.
The rest of you
Scotland has responded to yet more pc nonsense. But Scotland doesn’t seem to have pulled the info card with Rebel on it. And the apology? Basically a “we’re sorry if you are offended” varietal, which is not much of an apology. It is silliness to pay this much attention.
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Gravatar, it’s not really Bush’s fault. Dick Cheney made him do it.
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Frank #28.
I’ll bet the authors of that cartoon are using psuedonyms. However,the cartoon WAS printed in some source. Good for them.
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Llama – 13
Excellent points.
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And the apology? Basically a “we’re sorry if you are offended” varietal, which is not much of an apology. It is silliness to pay this much attention.
I think you are understating it. It was very much an apology. The police said that they should have sought the advise from their diversity person, and called it an oversight. I take that plainly to mean that they are admitting fault.
The reason this is worth our attention is that a police force is admitting fault and apologizing for something that is without fault. There is NOTHING wrong with putting a puppy on a police ad, yet the police are afraid to just say, “Get over it.”
Even though this is a Scottish affair, it is another example of Western culture’s complete intimidation of Islam.
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I wonder how many of you here on the blog live near them, or understand what it might be like. Reading about these things in a news article is much different than interacting daily.
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The title could just as well have said,
“Muslims are outraged over (fill in the blank)”
Get used to it people! England and France have all but become Muslim countries. Canada allows the practice of Sharia law. In Minneapolis Muslim cashier’s are not required to ring up pork products, etc.
A religion that advanced through hatred and violence gets pretty much whatever it wants.
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Can’t read the tinyurl link above. For some reason my browser won’t allow it.
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To Victoria #36
Islamic people are trying to get out of Islamic countries.
Their actions tell us all we need to know.
What Christian in their right mind would immigrate to an Islamic country?
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Someone, please help me here.
Now, I know in the Bible, an unclean animal meant one that an Israelite could not eat. If the Scottish folk were eating the little puppy, then that would be outrageous!
Maybe this from the Koran will help (because the Koran is so clear and meaningful):
“…and that for Him is the next production; and that he enriches and gives possession; and that He is the Lord of the Dog-star, and that He it was who destroyed ‘Ad of yore, and Thamud, and left none of them; and the people of Noah before them, verily, they were most unjust and outrageous! And the overthrown cities He threw down; and there covered them what did cover them!”
Ahhh! It all becomes clear to me now. The muslims think that the Scottish are trying to make their “Lord of the Dog-star” look cute! Perhaps they should have given the puppy a spiked collar and a leather jacket. Maybe that would help.
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…also, maybe if the puppy were growling and baring its menacing teeth…you know, looking like it’s ready to destroy and overthrow and “cover”…and chew on some poor kids shoe.
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The ultimate answer to the universe and everything!
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42
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No, Make it Man, you’re 43!
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Victoria, #36. In Virginia, I had a Muslem next-door neighbor. They didn’t associate with us. The children were nice and wouldn’t even to come into my yard to retrieve a ball without asking. The children evidently went to a Muslem school because a small bus came for them each day. His wife didn’t cover her head and wore pantsuits. We would wave at each other in the yard, but they weren’t open to conversation.
A relative lived across the street briefly. They would pool their trash for a single pick-up.
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Post 36
Good grief Victoria, why don’t you just add in a “those people” so that you can make your post complete.
I do work with Muslims every day. As a group of people I find them to be as wonderful and as flawed as any other group of people, including Christians, Hindus, Jews, Wiccans, etc.
Xion
Are you equally outraged when a Christian pharmacist is permitted to practice his or her profession according to his or her faith? Or when a Christan non-governmental organization is allowed to adhere to its faith by not emplying certain undesireables? If not you have a major double standard.
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I disagree with CB. It is not wrong to be outraged by people so ignorant that in 2008 they still consider dogs or pigs or any other animal “ritually unclean.”
It amazes me that the same people who come here to pick on Christians for disagreeing with Darwin come to the defense of ignorant brutes who would pick on a dog.
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I was wrong! They do see that little black puppy as menacing and scary. Apparently, they’re racists and believe that all black dogs are Satan, and while an angel may be powerful, the angel cannot enter a house with a dog or a picture. So we have a double whammy here. The poor muslims are getting pictures of dogs in the mail! How ever is the angel Gabriel supposed to visit them??!?!
See here:
http://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/dogs.htm
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I should have stated “pictures of pitch-black puppies.” Much more poetic.
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CB
Your liberal attitude is strong, but it has little persuasive power on those who have had much different experiences.
“THOSE PEOPLE” are not easy to live near. We deal with it every day where we live, and so do many others. It has nothing to do with how much money they have or how little -
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NJL, it’s not just little puppies, its anything they don’t like.
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NJ
Then you must have a problem with kosher Jews.
Victoria,
You don’t disappoint and your colors show who you are.
As for my “liberal” attitude, it basically comes down to taking people as they are and respecting their sensibilities. Example, I strongly disagree with the Christian pharmicists who refuses to do his/her job and dispense RU 487 if it is legally prescribed, however, I do respect his or her right to refuse. Same for restrictions on employing undesireables by Christian institutions. Nowhere I have I approved of the overweening pc’ness of the Scottish response to this bit silliness about dogs, although I do respect how Muslims feel, but when in Rome … That probably does sound liberal to you, to actually respect someone else’s sensibilities even when you disagree with them.
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“when in Rome”
Is Scotland now part of the muslim empire?
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CB, I have spent very little time with Jews who keep kosher. However, those I have spent time with haven’t criticized me for eating bacon. They don’t get outraged when I eat bacon, nor do they expect me to apologize for doing so.
If anyone is to adapt, it is the muslims to western society when they want to live in a western country. I don’t expect them to keep a dog as a pet, but I’m not going to be made to feel that there’s something wrong with having one in my own country — and neither should the Scots.
CB, support people who DO NOT respect my or your or anyone’s else’s sensibilities with respect to dogs all you want, but I have no respect for people who come to my country and expect to change my society by forcing this ridiculous and ignorant horsepucky down my throat.
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CB
If ‘those people’ are so disturbed because of dogs, I would wonder WHY they would move to a country that loves dogs, and most people have them for pets or dogs for hunting.
There is no ’sensibility’ when whining over a puppy in a photo, its petty, but doesn’t surprise me at all.
As far as my “COLORS” – I don’t subscribe to acquiescing to those who cannot accept the countries they imnigrate to, but rather begin uproars when they can’t have their own way.
We live in a wonderful area, _________ ________ more often than not park four feet from the curb, they park in front of fire hydrants, without a care in the world. They couldn’t care less if their car is blocking anything, it is their right (as far as their concerned) to do as they please. The police dept is now having to come and check througout the day, ticketing _____ ______ so that everyone will be safe, and that includes the children. And this is a beautiful area -
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Victoria, my sympathies. Do they pay their tickets? What does the municipal judge do?
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NJL
I don’t know if they pay their tickets or not – Lack of respect for others has certainly been plain and crystal clear –
Another interesting point; many lease homes, which are not inexpensive, – they moved in, turned off the automatic sprinkler system, let the gardener go, —- we all watched in amazement as the lawn turned brown, the trees and shrubs, and flowers began to die. The homeowners association was called — of course they ordered the sprinklers turned on, and they brought back the gardener. They simply don’t give a ______ !
They can well afford the gardener, etc. — they drive nice cars just like everyone else, however they don’t give one hoot about rules!
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#32 Peter Leavit,
You forget that McCain as aways pulled Cheney’s strings.
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NJ
As I did remark, when in Rome … I do think folks of any stripe, religious, or racial or whatever are wrong to foist their cultural foibles onto others in a new homeland.
Victoria
Sounds to me like your neighbors have issues with being neighborly and understanding the rules. I have similar neighbors who happen to be white, some would call them rednecks, (they park in front of fire hydrants allow their pitbulls to roam in the neighborhood and generally muck about much to the dismay of all of their neighbors) should I judge the entire class of whites on the basis of their behavior?
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For those not stuck on Old Testament ritual, Peter’s vision in Joppa (Acts 10) answers the question.
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#47 NJLawyer,
Look what you have done now. Now you will have the outraged Kosher Jewish Lawyers Association suing you in a class action for hate speech over the unclean pig thing you publicly tried to humiliate them with by bleating it out on a Christian Website during prime time. Thank goodness you are a lawyer adn can defend yourself
The Scepter lady on WMB will probably be forced to bonk you too for dragging them into the suit
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Well Said Victoria.
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Just a side story to make my point somewhat more interesting…maybe.
There is an older gentleman who came to work where I work. He has been very friendly to me and he and I “cut up” a little. He has a very distinct accent and a very Jewish sounding last name. The other day he sat down by me and handed me a homemade “Slim Jim” type thing. I was talking on the phone but was on hold. I asked him what was in it and he said mostly pork. My conversation started up again and he left. Later I passed by him and stopped to chat. I said forgive me but I made an assumption about you based on your last name but you gave me pork to eat. He started laughing and said “This Buffalo Jew will tear a pork chop apart.” He then started explaining a little about keeping Kosher and how much TROUBLE it is and how EXPENSIVE it is.
Anyway my point is with our modern ways of handling meat we should either be able to eat it all because it all is clean or not eat any of it because it all if filthy.
And religion aside there is just something wrong with anyone who doesn’t like baby animals.
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CB
YOU WRITE:…”Sounds to me like your neighbors have issues with being neighborly and understanding the rules.”
You MISS THE POINT – they understand the rules, they will not conform to ANY RULE unless it is enforced – and that isn’t always accepted, unless it’s done repeatedly. It also isn’t a matter of being “neighborly” – that is a misconception on many persons part, unless they live near them. It’s cultural, with NO intention of changing.
If I should start my list, as many who live here have a long one, it would take much of several threads. Rednecks are one thing _____ ____ are another.
You don’t understand or have a clue as to what goes on here. It’s a difficult situation at best, one which most people are coping with the best they can. What I shared with this thread is the very smallest of the problem, it doesn’t come close to the top of the list. This just isn’t a venue to share everything.
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No Wiglaff, I’m not 43, I’m 47.
You were at 42, now you’re at 53, and I said 42 because that’s the answer to the question. Unfortunately the dolphins left, and didn’t tell us what it was. But that means we’ve been annihilated doesn’t it?
Isn’t nonsense wonderful?
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Wow, I age fast. Probably because I owned a black puppy for a short period of time.
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I think muslim’s deserve to be ridiculed for their fear and loathing of puppies. It’s not even in the Koran!
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Victoria- (Off topic): Perhaps your neighbors want their yard to look like where they came from- a desert. You are in California, correct? Isn’t most of the southern part a desert? It is those easterners who moved out West and planted green things that need a lot of water that should have adapted to their new home and left it a desert. No wonder there is not enough water out West, everyone wants it to look like back East! (I know whereof I speak, having grown up in Tucson, AZ.)
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#54 NJL You nailed it.
“I have spent very little time with Jews who keep kosher, but … They don’t get outraged when I eat bacon, nor do they expect me to apologize for doing so.”
Nor do they slit your throat for not converting to their faith. Nor do they riot when you make a joke about them. Nor do they plot the overthrow of your country. Nor do they rejoice when innocent people are blown to bits.
Disclaimer for the highly sensitive: Of course, not all Muslims are this way. But then they are not very good Muslims, because they are disobeying the Koran and not following Muhammad.
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When my brother visited us right after 911 when he lived in Jakarta. He had married his Muslim Indonesian wife who was a ‘disco dancer’ and had converted to Islam by then. They came with their best Indonesian friends and one of them was a devout Muslim who had the ‘oh no, unclean dog look’ in his eyes as soon as he spotted our little Doxie Dog.
Like all Doxies, she was born to stupidity and liked nothing better than jumping up on strangers and licking them in the face, if she could get to it, immediately and as often as she could get away with it – regardless of religious affiliation. I’m guessing that stupid dog is probably Jewish since my wife and daughter are Jewish and it is technically my wife’s dog that my daughter picked out for her birthday, but the dog has never said for sure what religion she is, so I am guessing here.
These folks were going to stay with us for a week. I wasn’t sure how this was going to work out for sure with 4 Muslims, one fanatical, one an ex-Christian, one Christian, two Jews and a probable Jewish dog living together in a place that couldn’t possibly be big enough regardless of size. At least I had lived in Saudi Arabia for 10 years with Muslim room mates, knew the drill and could tell my family what to do. They, like all wives and children never listen to me though especially if I warn them to first – my mistake.
Strangely, it worked out OK with a few odd moments here and there. My brother decided to eat my BBQ pork ribs as did my wife, daughter and the dog. I smoked the Muslims a nice Kosher chicken and turkey on a separate shelf of the smoker. I didn’t make real bacon for breakfast and substituted turkey bacon which in no way looks or tastes like bacon for some reason.
My brother and I drank liquor and beer, my brother’s wife loved the daiquiris and margaritas and my wife drank wine. We even did a veggie lunch and a vegan dinner – they loved hot spicy stuff and fell in love with my habanero hot salsa. They would dip flour tortillas in it like shovels and wanted it for every meal and I couldn’t make it hot enough for them. Sometimes it would self immolate and they really thought that was something special I cooked up just for them.
When he wasn’t praying 5 times a day I would lock the dog outside or in a kennel so the devout Muslim wouldn’t have to wash himself so much that his skin would come off. None of the other Muslims were as fanatical as he was and my Jewish relatives are not Kosher or very religious even for Jews for that matter.
I even had the fanatical Muslim out at our shooting club firing every gun known to man, since he had supposedly never shot one. he liked the machine guns and no one seemed to care but he did get a little giddy, appearing happier than normal after a few clips and I though it best to politely disarm him in a nice way sooner than normal because you just can’t be too careful even if you are just having fun.
I took the UZI off him easy enough by giving him a tomahawk to throw instead. He loved it more than the machine guns I think and I felt better and little ashamed too since he could throw that tomahawk better than me. I gave it too him as a parting gift to remember the Wild West and the 2nd amendment fondly.
After the week was over, I was convinced, and sorta still am, that some non radicalized and sane; Muslims, possibly religious dogs and even a few Christians and some Jews (if they are not in a majority) could all accommodate each other and learn to live peaceable together like and without much difficulty so long as everyone was normally respectful to each other, didn’t try to kill each other when they least expected it in their sleep or was a closet socialist.
Since then, I think about that week often. Circumstances beyond my control have changed my initial conclusions somewhat due my brother’s onset of insanity a few years later, his proclivity to make bombs in bathrooms if not watched closely but that is another story for another day.
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Llama as always you make me laugh.
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Let’s review:
Islamic people are offended by the advertisement featuring a puppy.
But George “Mission Accomplished” Bush is going to turn them into a democracy at the end of a rifle?
Yes it all makes sense now.
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Victoria
Fair enough. Where are they from? Muslims come from all over the world which means as a religious group are affected by various cultures. All I am saying here is that it is unfair to judge an entire group on the basis of your neighbors. And even from their own culture, they may just be rubes.
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To CoyoteBlue
Since you don’t want to judge Islamic people can I assume you wouldn’t mind sending your children to a school filled with Islamic children?
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CB
Iran
We have a LARGE population, the examples I gave are not even on the top list. Our residential area is a very SMALL part of the problem. You would have to live here to comprehend the situation. Almost all countries in that region are involved.
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To Victoria
I think we get your point.
But what is your suggestion? Do we try and stop immigration into this country, do we try and democratize Islamic countries, do we try to intimidate them by military action? What?
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CB #52,
It’s RU-486. What you mention, RU-487, is the math co-processor for the real one.
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I realize that many of you don’t live in California, OR when you did, things were much different then they are today. Southern CA, and other areas have changed radically, the influx of those from ’some’ countries has become a problem which we all have to deal with, like it or not.
Please try to understand that it isn’t always easy to explain on a blog certain situations, it just isn’t prudent, I’m sure most of you understand, or at least I hope you would.
Living in many other places doesn’t afford you the opportunity to see on a daily basis, whether its where you live, work or shop to observe what I’ve tried to explain — and I’m certain my explanations are lacking, trying to preserve my identity and privacy –
Nick,
There is no easy answer, but there are some things which would help; to stop immigration and institute a two year moratorium — next, make it CLEAR that our laws and rules are not negotiable –
I don’t think democratizing their countries should go any further, we have done enough. I do believe we can’t waffle when a situation becomes apparent the USA is at risk.
The situations we, and ‘others’ see, is a real problem with intimidation, a stubborn ‘heels dug in’ placating, waiting to get their way –
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When I said “placating, waiting to get their way” I meant every word, because that is the game!
I would appreciate those of you who are led, to pray for us, to help us love, even when its SO hard to do.
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This just came over the wire:
Sharia law SHOULD be used in Britain, says UK’s top judge
By Steve Doughty
Last updated at 8:07 PM on 03rd July 2008
The most senior judge in England tonight gave his blessing to the use of sharia law to resolve disputes among Muslims.
Lord Chief Justice Lord Phillips said that Islamic legal principles could be employed to deal with family and marital arguments and to regulate finance.
He declared: ‘It is possible in this country for those who are entering into a contractual agreement to agree that the agreement shall be governed by a law other than English law.’
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Could this happen in the USA? — think about it — all the so called progressive movements that are taking place right here, front and center -
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I haven’t had time, no inclination to enter this fray, except I want to say that Victoria is essentially correct.
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We had a church yard sale at the end of May, and I decided to buy and cook hotdogs and brats (for free) to those attending. Eventually, a couple of Muslim ladies stopped by to look over the items. Stupid me, I never even considered such a possibility.
My wife (Cameron) came to me to ask if there were any non-pork items (these were free, so I wasn’t serving Hebrew National here, which really are quite good, btw). I was pretty sure that the last batch of brats I had cooked were all beef. She told this to the ladies, who took the probably-beef brats w/o any further questions. Of course, my wife noted that since the brats would have been cooked on the same grill as pork products, this should have (but didn’t) offend the women.
I’m guessing there are probably more than a few Muslims in this country who might even own a dog or two. I haven’t thought about this, but I’d been interested in finding it out. Of course, maybe other Muslims consider these to be the nominal or liberal Muslims.
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TJ, there are a very ‘few’ who own very small dogs.
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I read an interesting article on the internet by an Arab-Muslim-American (that’s his term) who finally yielded to his daughter’s wishes to get a puppy. He explains that the tradition they grew up with (in Egypt) said that if they had touched a dog, they had to do extra ritual washing in order for their prayers to be valid. With prayers said five times a day, it was simply more trouble than it was worth to have a dog in the house.
But he quickly discovered a big benefit to having a dog in America. When he had the dog with him, all of a sudden Americans became very friendly to him instead of viewing him with suspicion. He said one puppy did a lot more for changing Americans’ views of him than any amount of diversity training. I don’t know if he still does the extra ritual washing now, but he ends with a recommendation to Arab-Americans to get dogs.
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I wonder how much of the aversion to dogs is based upon cultural anachronisms. For instance, when Paul writes in Philippians 3, “Beware of those dogs…”, the term he uses does not refer to what we would think of as cute domesticated pets today, but wild canine scavengers that roamed villages and wallowed in garbage as a way of life. It’s not a mental stretch to see how someone might declare such a filthy animal as “unclean” (of course, that fits more with a modern sense of the word). Certainly, the postcard pooch is a bit different. And it’s a picture.
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Islam considers dogs and non-Muslims to be equally impure.
“There are eleven things which are impure: urine, excrement, sperm, bones, blood, dogs, pigs, non-Muslim men and women, wine, beer, and the sweat of the excrement-eating camel.”
“Any man or woman who denies the existence of Allah, or believes in His partners [the Christian Trinity], or else does not believe in His Prophet Muhammad, is impure (in the same way as are excrement, urine, dog, and wine).”
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In other words, Muhammad taught that everyone on this blog is the equivalent of excrement.
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Xion, check this out –
Menri – The Middle East Media Research Institute
Saudi Marriage Officiant: It Is Permitted to Marry a Girl Aged One Year, If Sex is Postponed; The Prophet Muhammad, Whose Model We Follow, Married ‘Aisha When She Was Six and Had Sex with Her When She Was Nine
Following are excerpts from an interview with Saudi marriage officiant Dr. Ahmad Al-Mu’bi. The interview aired on LBC TV on June 19, 2008:
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Pauline
YOU WRITE:…. “But he quickly discovered a big benefit to having a dog in America. When he had the dog with him, all of a sudden Americans became very friendly to him instead of viewing him with suspicion. He said one puppy did a lot more for changing Americans’ views of him than any amount of diversity training. I don’t know if he still does the extra ritual washing now, but he ends with a recommendation to Arab-Americans to get dogs.”
Pauline, can you see the manipulation? We who have to put up with it, are very aware of what’s going on. Your article isn’t a secret, but rather a blatant statement as to how _______ ‘try’ and fit in –
Everyone is savvy as to the technique’s that are used, — at least those who live in areas where its necessary to understand, being abreast of the latest little ways to manipulate the American’s. Thankfully we are not all ignorant of what’s going on.
I wish others would WAKE UP!
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Nick
Not judging a group by individual behavior of some is not at all the same as endorsing Islam as a religion. But that is probably a little too hard for you to grasp.
To answer your question, I would no more want my child going to an Islamic school than I would want my child to go to a Jewish, Christian or Hindu or Wiccan or whatever else one.
Victoria
I much appreciate your post 79 and think my prior posts were a little too hard on you. I apologize for that.
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Victoria #90- Everyone is savvy as to the technique’s that are used, — at least those who live in areas where its necessary to understand, being abreast of the latest little ways to manipulate the American’s. Thankfully we are not all ignorant of what’s going on.
I wish others would WAKE UP!
Watch out for those black helicopters! They might not contain US secret agents, but Arab invaders.
FYI: Oh, Victoria. You might need to use your pseudo-scepter on yourself for using “technique’s” instead of “techniques” (making a possessive instead of a plural noun).
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#89 Yes, purity in Islam is to behave like Muhammad (pbuh). This includes marrying infants, robbing camel trains, assassination, torture, murder, deception, terror, etc.
Those of us who disagree are like the “sweat of the excrement-eating camel” and cute puppies. Same thing.
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Kim wrote: “And religion aside there is just something wrong with anyone who doesn’t like baby animals.”
INDEED!
I had a similar experience with a law clerk regarding bacon. We used to order from the non-kosher Jewish deli. A #8 was chicken salad with bacon slices, so I mentioned this when the clerk ordered a #8. After he stopped laughing, he teased me that the vast number of American Jews eat bacon, pork chops, all sorts of non-kosher things. Over the years, I discovered that was true, but the Orthodox Jews did not get crazy — except for one who had dinner at the Judge’s house (he’s also Jewish). The kid told the judge’s wife that he would not eat her dinner, but rather a can of tuna on a paper plate no less.
We have a large Arab population in NJ. I plan to make inquiries regarding some of things I’ve read here. I’ve never heard or read about letting the lawn go, parking problems, etc, but I have no reason to go to the Arab towns.
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#90,
Victoria,
Knowing nothing more about the man who wrote that article than what he said in it, I could read it either as a case of manipulation to make other Americans less suspicious of him (when perhaps they had good reason to be), or of an immigrant taking one more step toward assimilation, leaving behind his own cultural prejudices (against dogs) and finding the friendship he had hoped for with his new fellow countrymen.
No doubt some Arab-Americans get dogs as a manipulative technique. I am not willing to assume that is always the case. This man didn’t get the dog for that reason, he got it because his daughter begged him to. The friendships it brought about were a side benefit he had not expected.
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CB, thank you. Your words, coming today mean a lot.
Have a wonderful 4th of July!
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