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	<title>Comments on: Finding common ground in Christ</title>
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		<title>By: TJ</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324821</link>
		<dc:creator>TJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Jul 2008 13:22:37 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>RN, just a couple of things. First, if you do not see or if you refuse to acknowledge the impact of Christianity on the western world (particularly since the time of the Reformation, but I would not bypass things like the rise of universities and such that came about in the Middle Ages), then that amounts to a gross denial of history. Christianity provided the worldview and rationale that made things you seem to take for granted, such as the rise of modern science or the existence of hospitals, possible. Remember that the next time you get in a vehicle to travel to a hospital. Only, don&#039;t thank a Christian. Thank God. :)

Second, you &lt;b&gt;do&lt;/b&gt; make lots of claims on this blog. Sometimes these are done in jest, sometimes not. In many ways, you are as &quot;evangelical&quot; as Mr. Barker, only not as aggressive. Being an agnostic is not really even accurate. If one were a consistent agnostic, he would attend a religious service of some sort at least 50% of the time. But one&#039;s actions typically demonstrate what he really believes. I would also apply this to the person who claimed to be a Christian but lived his life much the same as you do.

Finally, you will not calmly prepare yourself for an end without being reconciled with God. This only comes through Jesus Christ. But I would be glad to talk with you about this more at length elsewhere.

That is, if you are really serious about prepare for your end (but 65 ain&#039;t that close; my own dear mother is older than you, and she ain&#039;t nowhere near the end!).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RN, just a couple of things. First, if you do not see or if you refuse to acknowledge the impact of Christianity on the western world (particularly since the time of the Reformation, but I would not bypass things like the rise of universities and such that came about in the Middle Ages), then that amounts to a gross denial of history. Christianity provided the worldview and rationale that made things you seem to take for granted, such as the rise of modern science or the existence of hospitals, possible. Remember that the next time you get in a vehicle to travel to a hospital. Only, don&#8217;t thank a Christian. Thank God. <img src='http://online.worldmag.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Second, you <b>do</b> make lots of claims on this blog. Sometimes these are done in jest, sometimes not. In many ways, you are as &#8220;evangelical&#8221; as Mr. Barker, only not as aggressive. Being an agnostic is not really even accurate. If one were a consistent agnostic, he would attend a religious service of some sort at least 50% of the time. But one&#8217;s actions typically demonstrate what he really believes. I would also apply this to the person who claimed to be a Christian but lived his life much the same as you do.</p>
<p>Finally, you will not calmly prepare yourself for an end without being reconciled with God. This only comes through Jesus Christ. But I would be glad to talk with you about this more at length elsewhere.</p>
<p>That is, if you are really serious about prepare for your end (but 65 ain&#8217;t that close; my own dear mother is older than you, and she ain&#8217;t nowhere near the end!).
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		<title>By: Random Name</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324762</link>
		<dc:creator>Random Name</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Jul 2008 02:17:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>#28

I met Dan Barker in person after he debated a prominent Christian apologist.

He was pleasant and personable. We had a brief, cordial argument. I said I didn&#039;t see the point of &quot;evangelical atheism.&quot; 

He said he did. We both got bored with the discussion and drifted away from each other.

Seriously, I have met Christians I liked and Christians I disliked. 

I have met atheists I liked and atheists I disliked. 

If you look at the history of Christianity, there are many excellent episodes and many terrible episodes. I would say that people at this website tend to be in denial about the latter.

The terrible episodes of atheism are more spectacular, especially in the last few centuries. However, atheism is not the &quot;essence&quot; of Communism and Communism is not the essence of atheism.

Atheism is not a &quot;movement&quot; by itself. It&#039;s a lack of belief in God. It&#039;s not going to free people or make them good.

Christianity may bring people to Heaven and God. I don&#039;t think so; most here do.

Christianity has had a couple of thousand years to demonstrate that it solves the problems of our mundane world. I am a mundane person; I don&#039;t think Christianity has made it&#039;s case for the tremendous value for that world that most here think it does. Mileage varies.

I don&#039;t claim to know how to make a better world. I&#039;m just trying to take care of my family, help get my granddaughter started on an OK path, and calmly prepare myself for my end, which at 65 will be sooner rather than later.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#28</p>
<p>I met Dan Barker in person after he debated a prominent Christian apologist.</p>
<p>He was pleasant and personable. We had a brief, cordial argument. I said I didn&#8217;t see the point of &#8220;evangelical atheism.&#8221; </p>
<p>He said he did. We both got bored with the discussion and drifted away from each other.</p>
<p>Seriously, I have met Christians I liked and Christians I disliked. </p>
<p>I have met atheists I liked and atheists I disliked. </p>
<p>If you look at the history of Christianity, there are many excellent episodes and many terrible episodes. I would say that people at this website tend to be in denial about the latter.</p>
<p>The terrible episodes of atheism are more spectacular, especially in the last few centuries. However, atheism is not the &#8220;essence&#8221; of Communism and Communism is not the essence of atheism.</p>
<p>Atheism is not a &#8220;movement&#8221; by itself. It&#8217;s a lack of belief in God. It&#8217;s not going to free people or make them good.</p>
<p>Christianity may bring people to Heaven and God. I don&#8217;t think so; most here do.</p>
<p>Christianity has had a couple of thousand years to demonstrate that it solves the problems of our mundane world. I am a mundane person; I don&#8217;t think Christianity has made it&#8217;s case for the tremendous value for that world that most here think it does. Mileage varies.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t claim to know how to make a better world. I&#8217;m just trying to take care of my family, help get my granddaughter started on an OK path, and calmly prepare myself for my end, which at 65 will be sooner rather than later.
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		<title>By: opinionated teen</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324380</link>
		<dc:creator>opinionated teen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 14:59:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>In Chinese (probably other Aisen languages, too) there are no plurals or tenses. So saying, &quot;The horses were working hard&quot; would sound like &quot;Horse work hard&quot;.

But anyway!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In Chinese (probably other Aisen languages, too) there are no plurals or tenses. So saying, &#8220;The horses were working hard&#8221; would sound like &#8220;Horse work hard&#8221;.</p>
<p>But anyway!
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		<title>By: Pauline</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324287</link>
		<dc:creator>Pauline</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 12:12:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>#33
Panther,
To answer you questions from my point of view, it did not add anything to the conversation. 

On the face of it, it could simply be an accurate description, because people for whom English is a second language are likely to use grammar and syntax that make sense to them from their native language until they learn English better. I have known few Asians who were not already fluent in English, so I wouldn&#039;t know if there is any sound basis for Outkast&#039;s guess.

I attempt to respond only to people&#039;s actual statements and not speculate as to their intentions were in saying them. On that basis it seemed best to simply ignore the comment, which - taken literally - could simply be a description of observed language patterns.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#33<br />
Panther,<br />
To answer you questions from my point of view, it did not add anything to the conversation. </p>
<p>On the face of it, it could simply be an accurate description, because people for whom English is a second language are likely to use grammar and syntax that make sense to them from their native language until they learn English better. I have known few Asians who were not already fluent in English, so I wouldn&#8217;t know if there is any sound basis for Outkast&#8217;s guess.</p>
<p>I attempt to respond only to people&#8217;s actual statements and not speculate as to their intentions were in saying them. On that basis it seemed best to simply ignore the comment, which &#8211; taken literally &#8211; could simply be a description of observed language patterns.
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		<title>By: panther</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324266</link>
		<dc:creator>panther</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 05:45:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Sorry, I just got here.  Did I miss something?  Outkast, or anyone else, how is your comment at 24 appropriate, what does it add to the conversation, and why am I the first person to ask?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, I just got here.  Did I miss something?  Outkast, or anyone else, how is your comment at 24 appropriate, what does it add to the conversation, and why am I the first person to ask?
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		<title>By: Harris</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324263</link>
		<dc:creator>Harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 05:10:03 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>One of the readings in today&#039;s lessons in the BCP, is Romans 15.  Verse 7 jumped out at me,

&lt;i&gt;It can only be to God&#039;s glory, then, for you to treat each other i the same friendly way as Christ treated you.&lt;/i&gt; (Jerusalem Bible translation)

&lt;b&gt;A textual note&lt;/b&gt;: I love the translation, though honestly, it is a bit of a paraphrase.  The key Greek verb, &lt;i&gt;proslambanw&lt;/i&gt; doesn&#039;t have an especially clean English counterpart; it packs a great deal of culture.  

Anyways, this was the text that went into my journal.  And it seems a good one to keep in mind when the political discussion heats up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the readings in today&#8217;s lessons in the BCP, is Romans 15.  Verse 7 jumped out at me,</p>
<p><i>It can only be to God&#8217;s glory, then, for you to treat each other i the same friendly way as Christ treated you.</i> (Jerusalem Bible translation)</p>
<p><b>A textual note</b>: I love the translation, though honestly, it is a bit of a paraphrase.  The key Greek verb, <i>proslambanw</i> doesn&#8217;t have an especially clean English counterpart; it packs a great deal of culture.  </p>
<p>Anyways, this was the text that went into my journal.  And it seems a good one to keep in mind when the political discussion heats up.
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		<title>By: KayVee</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324146</link>
		<dc:creator>KayVee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 21:19:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>My point yesterday was not that there are divergent opinions on a variety of topics, it was that we [as a populace] seem to be losing the ability to discuss opposing opinions respectfully. I deplore the use of childish name calling [or altering] or unverifiable &quot;quotes&quot; from the hated candidate. When a candidate is quoted as saying something, the actual news report or document is the verification, not a string of one blogger quoting another blogger. 

I know that in the distant past campaign rhetoric was more vile than it is today, but we seemed to have gotten past that for a while, only to be headed back in that direction lately. It&#039;s usually not the candidates themselves that use hatred as a weapon, it&#039;s often the everyday blogger or some low level surrogate that acts as if the other political party is the enemy, instead of just a group of people that see things differently than they do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My point yesterday was not that there are divergent opinions on a variety of topics, it was that we [as a populace] seem to be losing the ability to discuss opposing opinions respectfully. I deplore the use of childish name calling [or altering] or unverifiable &#8220;quotes&#8221; from the hated candidate. When a candidate is quoted as saying something, the actual news report or document is the verification, not a string of one blogger quoting another blogger. </p>
<p>I know that in the distant past campaign rhetoric was more vile than it is today, but we seemed to have gotten past that for a while, only to be headed back in that direction lately. It&#8217;s usually not the candidates themselves that use hatred as a weapon, it&#8217;s often the everyday blogger or some low level surrogate that acts as if the other political party is the enemy, instead of just a group of people that see things differently than they do.
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		<title>By: Victoria</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324104</link>
		<dc:creator>Victoria</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 19:55:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>OP :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OP <img src='http://online.worldmag.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />
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		<title>By: opinionated teen</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-324100</link>
		<dc:creator>opinionated teen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 19:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Random Name: When someone turns from &quot;religion&quot; to Atheism or Agnosticism, you quietly think, &quot;Ah, someone enlightened!&quot; and smile. When someone turns from Atheism or Agnosticism to Christ, the angels rejoice in Heaven. It&#039;s hard to keep quiet. :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Random Name: When someone turns from &#8220;religion&#8221; to Atheism or Agnosticism, you quietly think, &#8220;Ah, someone enlightened!&#8221; and smile. When someone turns from Atheism or Agnosticism to Christ, the angels rejoice in Heaven. It&#8217;s hard to keep quiet. <img src='http://online.worldmag.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />
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		<title>By: TJ</title>
		<link>http://online.worldmag.com/2008/07/23/finding-common-ground-in-christ/comment-page-1/#comment-323907</link>
		<dc:creator>TJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 14:34:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>#27: Google &quot;Dan Barker&quot;

Plenty of folks that aren&#039;t Christian post on WOW. Are they &quot;the best&quot; or &quot;the least&quot; or &quot;something inbetween&quot;?

My point? Only one lens of those rose-colored glasses seems to be working. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#27: Google &#8220;Dan Barker&#8221;</p>
<p>Plenty of folks that aren&#8217;t Christian post on WOW. Are they &#8220;the best&#8221; or &#8220;the least&#8221; or &#8220;something inbetween&#8221;?</p>
<p>My point? Only one lens of those rose-colored glasses seems to be working. <img src='http://online.worldmag.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />
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