Comments on: More miracles http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/ A forum for discussion of news that arises at the intersection of Christianity and culture. Sat, 21 Nov 2009 19:31:02 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: klasko http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331835 klasko Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:23:39 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331835 Thank you for sharing that, OutDeep. Sometimes we're the ones who plant the seeds. Somestimes we're the ones who reaps the harvest. The sower does not always get to be the one who reaps the harvest. It's good to remember that. Thank you for sharing that, OutDeep.

Sometimes we’re the ones who plant the seeds. Somestimes we’re the ones who reaps the harvest. The sower does not always get to be the one who reaps the harvest. It’s good to remember that.

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]]> By: Karen O http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331832 Karen O Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:20:31 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331832 Outdeep - I have a dear Christian friend who was involved with AA for many years. She told me she knew of many who had come to Christ through their AA experiences. Outdeep – I have a dear Christian friend who was involved with AA for many years. She told me she knew of many who had come to Christ through their AA experiences.

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]]> By: outdeep http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331808 outdeep Fri, 15 Aug 2008 13:19:52 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331808 I agree with Andree that miracles themselves do not convert. There must be willingness within to recognize the miracle as an act of God and a willingness to acknowledge God as God. Otherwise, the power of the miracle is simply a phenomenon that is too easily discarded. I know many of us Christians are troubled with AA's “Higher Power as I understand Him” fearing one might simply make up their own God to their own suiting and miss the atonement and resurrection completely. Nevertheless, I think there is some wisdom in their approach that we Christians can learn from. When someone comes to their program as an agnostic without any interest in God AA says, “well, why don't you just be open to the notion that there is something greater than You that can do for you what you cannot do for yourself?” More often than not, if someone is willing to take that small step, they eventually become a strong believer in God. My sponsor's sponsor was a raging Atheist (his words) when he started his program and now is probably the greatest advocate for me to get on my knees and turn my life over to God in every situation. I would prefer such programs would bring folks all the way to Christ, but I do think they are very effective in taking the atheist and bringing them to the place where they are open to Divine miracles and turning one’s life over to the God that performs them. Many then do come to Christ. I agree with Andree that miracles themselves do not convert. There must be willingness within to recognize the miracle as an act of God and a willingness to acknowledge God as God. Otherwise, the power of the miracle is simply a phenomenon that is too easily discarded.

I know many of us Christians are troubled with AA’s “Higher Power as I understand Him” fearing one might simply make up their own God to their own suiting and miss the atonement and resurrection completely.

Nevertheless, I think there is some wisdom in their approach that we Christians can learn from. When someone comes to their program as an agnostic without any interest in God AA says, “well, why don’t you just be open to the notion that there is something greater than You that can do for you what you cannot do for yourself?”

More often than not, if someone is willing to take that small step, they eventually become a strong believer in God. My sponsor’s sponsor was a raging Atheist (his words) when he started his program and now is probably the greatest advocate for me to get on my knees and turn my life over to God in every situation.

I would prefer such programs would bring folks all the way to Christ, but I do think they are very effective in taking the atheist and bringing them to the place where they are open to Divine miracles and turning one’s life over to the God that performs them. Many then do come to Christ.

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]]> By: chalzz http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331690 chalzz Fri, 15 Aug 2008 01:06:49 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331690 Being a witness to a miracle might temporarily turn a heart towards God. But as proved out by Pharoh and the Egyptians, they were witness to countless miracles and as far as I know, there was no mass conversion of the Egyptians to the God of the Israelites. Eventually, a heart that acknowledges God due to witness of a miracle, if the heart is not converted, will eventually fall away as the trials of life will bury them back into the state they were in prior to the miracle. Of course, witnessing miracles can cause someone to acknowledge a "Higher Power", but unless they come to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ for the salvation of their sins through this experience, their acknowledgement is worthless. Being a witness to a miracle might temporarily turn a heart towards God. But as proved out by Pharoh and the Egyptians, they were witness to countless miracles and as far as I know, there was no mass conversion of the Egyptians to the God of the Israelites.

Eventually, a heart that acknowledges God due to witness of a miracle, if the heart is not converted, will eventually fall away as the trials of life will bury them back into the state they were in prior to the miracle.

Of course, witnessing miracles can cause someone to acknowledge a “Higher Power”, but unless they come to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ for the salvation of their sins through this experience, their acknowledgement is worthless.

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]]> By: REG http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331588 REG Thu, 14 Aug 2008 21:06:08 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331588 9- NT, I really like having you around, I mean, wow, I mean, WOW, thanks for that thought!! YES!! That is true, of course. Except that some "Christians" make divisions where there are none. 9-
NT,
I really like having you around, I mean, wow, I mean, WOW, thanks for that thought!! YES!! That is true, of course. Except that some “Christians” make divisions where there are none.

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]]> By: Night Train http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331521 Night Train Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:25:39 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331521 Uh, I thought Christians believed that Jesus, being God, WAS the author of those two books? Uh, I thought Christians believed that Jesus, being God, WAS the author of those two books?

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]]> By: REG http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331511 REG Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:07:29 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331511 David was an individual expressing the truth of what God does in individuals. Christ is in the Psalms. David was an individual expressing the truth of what God does in individuals. Christ is in the Psalms.

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]]> By: outkast http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331496 outkast Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:55:02 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331496 The best wisdom is found through the Psalms and Proverbs? I don't think so, although there's a lot of wisdom in those two books. The best wisdom is found through Jesus Christ, who was much wiser than King David or the other authors of those two O.T. books. Christ's miracles were much greater than those of the New Testament as well, as His miracles touched people individually rather than through nations. The best wisdom is found through the Psalms and Proverbs? I don’t think so, although there’s a lot of wisdom in those two books. The best wisdom is found through Jesus Christ, who was much wiser than King David or the other authors of those two O.T. books.

Christ’s miracles were much greater than those of the New Testament as well, as His miracles touched people individually rather than through nations.

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]]> By: llama http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331412 llama Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:15:16 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331412 Sorry wrong thread I will move it Sorry wrong thread I will move it

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]]> By: llama http://online.worldmag.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/comment-page-1/#comment-331411 llama Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:14:32 +0000 http://www.worldontheweb.com/2008/08/14/more-miracles/#comment-331411 #2 Blue, And don't tell me it is Bush's fault the US military is spread too thin either when it was Clinton that cut the military nearly in half and the left has had nearly two full years now to pull the troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan any time they wanted. this had been their war since they took over congress and took the responsibility and are now entirely accountable for it. You need to talk to the left if want the US military spread less thin or you want it bigger. No one can stand int heir way. The problem is they don't have a way, a plan or a clue when it comes to this nations defence. #2 Blue,

And don’t tell me it is Bush’s fault the US military is spread too thin either when it was Clinton that cut the military nearly in half and the left has had nearly two full years now to pull the troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan any time they wanted. this had been their war since they took over congress and took the responsibility and are now entirely accountable for it.

You need to talk to the left if want the US military spread less thin or you want it bigger. No one can stand int heir way. The problem is they don’t have a way, a plan or a clue when it comes to this nations defence.

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