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Whirled Views 8.30
Happy Saturday!
Today’s quote is from a theologian: “Patience is the companion of wisdom.”
Topic: Watercooler Chatter, WorldMagBlog
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Saint Augustine?
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Other ways to read this:
1. Impatience is the companion of fools?
2. Impatience is the enemy of widom?
3. Patience is the enemy of fools?
?
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It’s been a long time since I told the “What’s time to a pig?” joke.
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KBells, what was the answer to your son’s joke?
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Halt hitting the blind
I would appreciate the conservative Christians at this web site to deconstruct the following for me. Be sure to read the comments after the main story to really see what is going on.
http://tiny.cc/halthittingtheblind
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Sorry, it wasn’t a joke. It was just sentence that contained a lot of words he knew how to spell.
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Saturday’s a very slow day, so it won’t be noticed when I reveal that I have a sinister scheme afoot.
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Do tell…
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Yeah, Random, do tell.
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I might notice, especially if you reveal it.
Saturdays tend to be slow during the football season.
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KBR has been accused of human trafficking.
One more stain on the shirt of this nation.
Say NO to more of the same. Vote NO on mcsame.
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Say NO to comment spam!
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I say NO to comment spam by skipping it. It’s in the “No read zone!!”
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I join Karen and Bob:
I say NO to comment spam – it isn’t in keeping with the spirit of this blog -
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Revealed in due time.
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No! To comment spam! Don’t try to advertise your products here– ever!
Yes! To information!
Yes! To Whirled Views being a place for free speech and open discussion!
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I agree with Lumps on this. WV should be a free speech soapbox.
Nobody has to read or comment. As long as It’s not objectionable, go to it.
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I agree with Chas
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Random,
Read the link/comments. Sounds like the typical jumping-to-conclusions-without-enough-information that goes on often enough. Was there a deeper question you wanted answered?
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it looks like Focus on the Family’s rain prayer worked. God decided who really needed to have their convention disrupted in the end.
Do any of you live in Gustav’s path? What are you doing to prepare? My prayers are with you.
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To All at WMB:
I ran across an article in the August IEEE Spectrum magazine on people in persistent vegetative states and the actual level of consciousness they experience. Some excerpts are:
1. “End-of-life decisions in nonresponsive patients like Englaro and American Terri Schiavo pose a deep challenge to the science of consciousness. When these types of cases go to trial, courts spend much of their time hearing opinions on whether the patient is truly in a vegetative state and whether he or she has any chance of improving. The controversy surrounding these disputes is due in part to the primitive methods we rely on when assessing consciousness.”
2. “Niels Birbaumer, a neurobiologist at the University of Tübingen, in Germany, used EEG recordings to study the brain activity of patients diagnosed as vegetative and found unexpected levels of cortical activity.”
3. “In this particular example, Birbaumer’s group was looking for a dip in the wave 400 milliseconds after a patient heard an incorrect sentence. The dip is called the N400, and many neuroscientists regard it as the cortical signature for processing semantic errors.”
4. “What the group found challenges the diagnoses of many of the patients they tested. Of the 38 participants considered persistently vegetative, 22 percent responded to semantic errors with an N400wave effect. The group found similar results when testing the ability to discriminate between tones of different pitches. The data suggest that these patients are capable of a higher level of processing than previously thought. Although they cannot interact with their environment, many people with severe brain injuries may still be responding to it internally.
Gives you pause to think what we might have done to Terry Schaivo, doesn’t it. Read the full article (it is not technical) at:
http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/aug08/6534.
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Chas, do I remember correctly that you all live in Hendersonville?? (Or was it Henderson). Hubby and I have been throwing around the idea of moving a little further south–he mentioned Hendersonville b/c of some author who is on the board of a good Christian school there. Thought it was funny–I don’t often mention the “particulars” of the folks I “know” on WOW as he’s not really into the whole computer thing. Just curious…
Blessings!
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Momoffour,
In case Chas doesn’t get back on to see your question, yes, he lives in Hendersonville, NC. Beautiful area, if that’s where you’re looking. My denomination’s conference center/retreat center/campground is there, so we visit quite a bit as well.
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Momoffour, I live in Hendersonville, NC. Lots of people get that confused with Henderson, NC. Henderson is in I-85, we are in the mountains on I-26 between Asheville and Spartanburg.
Moving to Hendersonville, or any other place for that matter, depends on why you want to be there. There are several Christian schools in the area. I would suggest that you be sure you have a job before coming. I can tell you more about the area if you’re interested.
Worthy Girl might have better information on the job outlook in the Christian school area.
It’s a friendly place, but there is always a difference between the natives and lateer arrivals.
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Thanks for the info, Chas. I knew there was a difference in the two–I had a great-uncle who lived in Henderson and had visited him often. Obviously, if we were to move, it would be many years from now–and no, we wouldn’t move without a reason. He is just feeling way too close to the whole Northern Virginia thing right now. We’ve talked about Georgia and Louisiana as well (haven’t really researched those options yet, though). I remember the author now–he wrote a wonderful piece on the history of the Confederate flag–Mike Scruggs (I’m 90% sure on the name…)
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During Katrina 900,000 gallons of oil were spilled. Let’s hope there is less spilled during Gustav.
1 million people are being evacuated from NO today. Remember them in your prayers today. May the lord provide them with safety and keep their homes from harm.
In an election year, I expect a good response from FEMA and Bush. He won’t be eating cake with john McCain like last time!
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Dr. Dave, there was a case in California recently that was similar to Terri Schiavo’s. The hospital went to court to get a non-family member appointed as guardian who decided the patient should be killed the same way as Terri. The husband went to court and fought it, and the court sided with him.
This desire to kill people like this, this insistence that Down Syndrome babies be aborted — all culture of death. Sick and wrong.
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Momoffour, do you live in Northern Virginia? We lived in Annandale.
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We live in central Virgina in the beautiful Blue Ridge. It’s beautiful HERE, just too close to THERE!
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“He is just feeling way too close to the whole Northern Virginia thing right now.”
Momoffour – What does that mean? What is “the whole Northern Virginia thing”?
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From my perspective, NOVA is a totally different “country” than the part of Va we are in. Don’t misunderstand me–it’s absolutely nothing personal against the folks there (most of my extended family lives there), we’re just country at heart. All around our small county (and esp from NOVA), the “city” just keeps on spreading further out. And the rare times I do any kind of shopping or whatever in NOVA, I’m not sure what the primary language is! Please don’t misunderstand me, Karen O–my family just feels the need to get further away from it before it spreads down to us!
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I made this late reply to a post (now old) where Tony Woodleif asked; “Is your church a hospital or a courtroom?”
My reply:
Two lousy choices I would say. Hospitals are obsessed with building, building, building and money, money, money. They are constantly doing building projects and programs and they demand money for their healing services. And courtrooms are also very expensive, win or lose. And they are sooooo legalistic!
Okay, this is tongue in cheek, a bit, but it seems that churches are so often criticized for things that are so expected or acceptable in other institutions or entities.
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this insistence that Down Syndrome babies be aborted… #27…. NJL can you point me in the direction of this insistence? Is this some type of document that I can read or some website maybe? I’d like to read up on it, I am not at all familiar with it.
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Scott, depending on where you read it, between 70 and 90% of babies with Down’s are aborted. Doctors and colleagues put a lot of pressure on people to abort in such a case, I’ve heard. The medical community is now recommending that younger mothers be screened than used to be recommended (a recent change), because an occasional baby is accidentally not killed because the mother was too young to thinkk she was at risk. You can probably google or check amazon for more.
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I’ve have returned from RevGen 2008. My ears hurt. And I don’t mind at all. It was COOOOOL!! We arrived, went with some of my Pastor’s family, around 8:30, in the beautiful Frenchtown NJ area. Nice area. I signed in, put on my backstage access braclet, and headed for my destination, the Philadelphia stage. You see this was to be no ordinary concert for me. I had the priviledge of being the band escort for Skillet. Yes, the Skillet! But I’ll get back to them later.
The band arrived early in the AM, so they were parked behind the stage area in their tour bus, resting. Myself, and driver Mike, were tasked with being available should the band need anything, and to get them to their appointed place, at the appointed time, by van or golf cart. Other than that you’re freed up to wander close by. And did I mention I was backstage? So while the band rested and prepared, I got to see some kick butt metal up close and personal. You could go anywhere except up on the stage. August Burns Red led of the day. I also got to see The Devil Wears Prada. The Myriad, and Norma Jean. Later, after Skillet and Stephen Baldwin, I watched Flyleaf perform. Now Stephen Baldwin didn’t sing, he gave a speech. Started slow, but really picked it up later. Talked about Hollywood, and his experiences with it. A good message all in all. And I got to walk around with, and even talk to these bands, all day long!!!!
Now on to Skillet!! The first thing they did was an interview. The lead singer and bass player, John Cooper, did that. Later, it was equipment load and sound check. Then the band took the stage at 3:30. And they rocked!! I got to stand near security in the fenced area between the first row of people and the stage. It was pretty awesome!!! And LOUD!!! The band did a fantastic job, and the crowd loved it. The young lady on the drums, Lori Peters, can whale on the drums like nobodies business!! Lead guitarist Ben Kasicas made that thing scream. Korey Cooper plays great keyboards, and sings and plays guitar. The lady is non-stop movement. She’s good. John Cooper, the front man, and bass player was on, and the crowd loved him. They played alot of crowd favorites, and were fantastic in doing it. 2 thumbs up!!!
I spent my day at 1 of 3 stages. The acts I didn’t see were Jack Redmond, Gateway, Evangel, Shawn McDonald, Phil Keaggy, Bethany Dillon, Robbie Seay Band, Kutless, Matt Wertz, Justin Lookadoo, Sixpence, NewsBoys, and Toby Mac. There is certainly lots to see at RevGen.
In closing, I just have a few more things that are noteworthy. Throughout the day today, testimonies were shared by band members, Christ was praised and glorified, and the Gospel was given. I saw bands go out of their way to interact with their fans. I got to see a young girl of about 12, stricken with brain cancer, who sadly will probably not live to see next year, granted her dying wish. The picture on her face when she left the backstage area, after meeting the band, was priceless. When we took Skillet for their autograph session, we were directed to the wrong gate. Some of the crowd, and several kids noticed. The band simply smiled and some began talking with the kids, and showing kindness and appreciation to them. They could have ignored them, or asked to leave, but didn’t. The members of Skillet were a very pleasant surprise to me. They made my day. They were kind, pleasant, and made an effort to show gratitude to their fans. I was so impressed that after the autograph line had gone thru, I got in on the end and asked them to sign a band photo for me, which they did. I gave it to my daughter because this is one band I won’t mind her listening to at all. Real class acts. When it was done, and we were back in the cart, a teenager asked Ben Kasica if he could get a picture. Not only did he allow the picture, he also joked around with the kid. After that we took the band back to the bus, and my day with the band was complete.
Today I had the opportunity to see a talented band, preach Christ, glorify Christ, and show this old metal head that there’s a better alternative to whats offered from most metal bands. I saw a love of Christ, and a love of their fans. And it was inspiring. I think I may actually start playing guitar again, once my arm heals. This was a good day, and the best concert I’ve ever seen, because it was much more than just music. I’m definately goin’ next year!!
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Oh, and I forgot to mention, I have pictures and some video!!!!!!!
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Cheryl, I can’t find a thing suggesting that anyone is insistent upon abortions for Downs Babies. I’m just looking for NJL’s reference for such a bold statement. I’ll accept help from anyone. For this this is happening, I might have to take up the cause.
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Scott-
You won’t find it. And NJL never supports her generalized statements. We’re just supposed to accept them because she’s a lawyer in New Jersey
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Welcome home AJ! I can’t read all that on a phone, but will when I’m back to a real screen. You must have had a blast toppst so much!
Blessings to you!
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no one on the Gulf Coast with an update? This must be really bad. We’re all praying for you! Let us know how you are when you can.
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I used the word “insistent” because I heard on the news that people are viewed as not doing their “duty” if they don’t abort Down Syndrome babies. It is frowned upon and looked down upon by the medical professionals (just as, I might add, as that guardian out there in Calif. The doctors went along with him — he made a “practical” solution. I’m not going to be the one who tells mothers carrying a Down Syndrome baby that “it’s for the best” to abort. These babies bring a great deal of joy into their families. And this is a slippery slope that ought not to be encouraged.
You’re just bent out of shape because you can’t find anything that says women are ENCOURAGED to have a Down Syndrome baby.
As we watch Trig Palin grow, people will see that he’s a valued member of a family. I realize the leftys would much rather take on a Chinese version of life — kill what isn’t practical — but not all of us are ready to go there yet – if ever.
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It wouldn’t bother me if they canceled the convention this week and did a short version next week for a few hours. Let Bush speak, Palin speak, nominate and affirm McCain by acclamation, he gives his speech and we all go to bed.
What say you?
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And guys, put in google “Down Syndrome Abortion Results” and you’ll find all sorts of interesting things.
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#19 Cameron
Thank you for your sensible comment.
As you know, I suffer from irony poisoning, something like shingles. It was just a brief flare up. I’m OK for the moment.
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OK NJL, I just wanted to make sure that it wasn’t based on a fact(s) available to you and I. I was concerned that I was missing something big and was prepared to fight with you if that was the case. Consider it open-minded of me. And to get it straight, I was bent out of shape to think that there was an insistence to abort down babies. As you’ve noted, you don’t have a fact to back it up it’s just what you heard on the news.
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Well, Scott, it you go to that google site using the words I gave you and you read through some of those things, you’ll find what I did: that women who are determined to have a Down Syndrom baby are given a video that isn’t balanced in its portrayal of what happens with these kids. This is just like abortionists who wouldn’t show the truth by showing a woman a sonogram. Nor do they allow normal, open discussion of depression as well as other consequences to abortion. That information is easily found through google. I’m not making it up. The “facts” are available — just not distributed to women so they can make a TRULY informed choice. It’s heavy-handed and not in favor of the woman having the child, so you may not like the work “insistence,” but there’s a BIG element of truth in that word. Is is legally required to abort a Down Syndrome baby? Not yet. But it’s coming.
I’m sure you’ll also read on that page the report of a woman who had a cleft palate in utero. She notes she’s had a fine life, and the minor disability was corrected, etc. I guess people like you don’t care about a cure for spina bifida when all you have to do is convince women to kill their child. Many people with disabilities accomplish great things. Eugenics through abortion is NOT the way to go.
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Checking in from the Gulf Coast. I am on the eastern edge of the projected path. My aunt has been preparing since Friday. I as early as this morning drank my coffee on the deck in the sunshine. Lower atmosphere clouds are moving west rapidly and there is a slight breeze but nothing scary. This house I am in was built in the 1930’s so it has been through some major storms. I do have real working metal Bermuda shutters so if it gets too bad I can go into “lockdown”. Right now I am washing cloths and dishes to make sure everything is clean just in case we are without power for a while. Unless it comes straight up Mobile Bay I think I will be fine. I think we should all continue to pray for those along the Louisiana coast.
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I suggest that those who favor eugenics through abortion watch the MDA telethon this weekend. Watch some of those films of the fund those kids have at camp. No one wants to see them suffer, but why deny them – or those healthy around them – the benefit of their association.
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Is is [sic] legally required to abort a Down Syndrome baby? Not yet. But it’s coming. This is propaganda, clearly. However, if that happens, I’ll stand right next to you and fight just as hard as you against it. Until then, your grossly slanted insinuations are just your opinions and not worthy of further consideration. If you should have any other evidence, I’ll be happy to review it.
By the way, it’s a personal responsibility to seek the information you need to make a proper decision when it comes to a medical procedure. To blame an abortionist for the personal choice someone makes is ludicrous.
For the record, I favor choice (I would strongly counsel ANYONE I know against it), I don’t favor eugenics. The two are not connected the way you suggest as much as you’d like to think so.
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When disabled children are aborted, that is eugenics through abortion. And that’s what is happening.
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I favor doctors screening younger women for birth defects. My stepmother was only 21 when she had Toni who is now 48 and has Downs. I chose amnio when I was pregnant with Chloe. There are decisions to be made. Down’s babies often have heart defects. I could have chosen to have her at a women’s and children’s hospital rather than at the Catholic hospital where I had her. Not all “choice” leads to abortion. Now we are finding that some things like heart defects can be surgically repaired in utero.
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NJL, maybe in your world that’s what it means. I suggest, however, that you check a simple reference like Webster’s Dictionary to learn what it really means. And, that’s NOT what’s happening. What’s happening, rightly or wrongly, is that we’re taking the path of least resistance. Raising a Downs baby or any baby for that matter isn’t easy and isn’t cheap. However, if you roll the dice you take your chances when it comes to pregnancy and birth defects. Don’t make it into a conspiracy. Did you hear 9-11 was an inside job?
If they found a “gene” that, if we could remove it form the gene pool, would eradicate the thought of abortion from the heads of humans, would you then support eugenics? I hope and pray to your god that you say no.
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Scott – Here’s a piece of annecdotal evidence for you. One of my very dear friends’ unborn child tested positive for Downs syndrome. She was urged by her OB-GYN to abort. She chose not to, and found herself a new OB-GYN who was more in tune with her beliefs and needs. It does exist in today’s medical climate.
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Urging does NOT equal insistence. Your dear friend chose the right thing for her which puts a big smile on my face. I urge you to stop praying because it’s a useless waste of time, that is not insistence.
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Thank you, Klasko.
The meanings of words in dictionaries change every day.
I never said it was a “conspiracy,” you did. I said it happens and it happens every day. Read those documents to which I pointed you, really read them. You can’t honestly tell me that the medical profession is not recommending that aborting the disabled is the way to go. Add in euthanasia, assisted suicide, court-ordered deaths like Terri Schaivo and you have one slippery slope.
Your cure is abortion, mine is research on disease.
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So, then, NJL, what, we can never rely of the dictionary for anything? Come on, really now…this conversation is sounding sillier by the minute. If by “your” in the last paragraph you mean me, you could not be more wrong. I’ll assume you don’t.
I recommend/urge/ask/suggest that you give up your faith. None of that is that is insistence? It’s not. No one is insisting on any abortions under any circumstances. Show me where there is insistence and I’ll take up the fight with you. Insistence is a much strong connotation that urging, which is the reason why you chose that word. You are, however, incorrect.
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#42
NJL, I agree go on with the convention.
The whole question of convention or not? Bush/Cheney yes no etc. is rather silly. Canceling the convention would do nothing to stop a hurricane.
The Republicans are in a no-win situation. Carrying on with the convention as planned will remind people of their Katrina response yet canceling will seem like a cynical ploy to make up for the Katrina fiasco. Hence, they will (and should) go with a more subdued convention which comes at a cost to a momentum.
Bush and Cheney canceled their appearances. However, this seemingly ready for action will appear cynical when juxtapositioned with a photo of McCain’s birthday cake three years ago during Katrina.
And then we have the irony of FOF praying for rain during Obama’s speech and instead a hurricane happens during the Republican convention.
Michael Moore revels in the irony
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/message/index.php?id=229
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I must make a correction to my post at #35. In my excitement to post about my day, I incorrectly named one of the band members of Skillet. Lori Peters is the former drummer for the band. The current drummer, and the young lady I saw yesterday, is named Jen Ledger. She is from Coventry England, and is 18 yrs. old. She’s been with the band for about 8 months. I wondered why she looked so much different, and younger. Now I know. I feel like a knucklehead. At least I didn’t call her Lori.
And now that I know who she is, and that she’s only 18, I’m even more impressed. This young lady is GOOD!! She must have started playing drums before she started walking, to be that good at such a young age. Most impressive. And again my apologies for wrongly naming her. She certainly earned the right to have me get it right, and I hope this clears things up.
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I sit safely ensconced in Atlanta, having left Baton Rouge on Friday ahead of the hurricane. I left behind co-workers and friends who have decided to ride it out. I doubt I will sleep tonight. Baton Rouge floods very easily with just a little bit of rain, though it is nowhere near as low lying as New Orleans. Having been to New Orleans several times this year, I can more easily identify with the pictures and video I see online and on TV.
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For the last hour or so, my wife and I have been discovering who Jen Ledger is. WOW! I’m such an idiot sometimes. Not only do I now have a better idea who she is, but she’s even more talented than I witnessed yesterday. This young lady is a one women band! I predict that she will be BIG. She is a fantastic singer, writes songs, plays keyboards, and plays the drums like nobodys business.
She seems comfortable doing many different genre as well. If you like Carly Simon, check out Jen’s cover of “Killing Me Softly”. Also at this link to her MySpace page, you can here her do 3 others, and I highly recommend that you do. Especially the 4th one titled “My Masterpiece”. She wrote, sings, and plays the keys. It’s a very good piece.
http://www.myspace.com/jennyandmarie
And then when you’re done with that, you can watch and listen, to her doing a drum solo. This is a little bit louder style here, since it’s with Skillet. She does it all folks.
http://www.godtube.com/view_video.php?viewkey=cfd5fd53de7182445669
You might not know her yet. But eventually, you probably will.
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Nice to hear that you’re safe Anlir. I wish the best for the friends and co-workers you left behind. And if I may be so bold, and I usually am, as you know, I have a little advice for you. If you have difficulty unwinding and relaxing this evening, please take my advice and click the link to the myspace page for Jen Ledger in #60. This young lady sings beautifully and softly in these 4 songs. It is very relaxing and easy to listen to. Try it, and I hope you get some sleep tonight.
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Thanks for the updates from Kim and Anlir. I have been praying often for everyone in your area and it looks like it’s paying off. Gustav is now guessed to come in as just a cat 3 instead of a 5! You two take care and I will keep praying for your friends and family.
It’s weird this site hasn’t given us a thread on this, but like 100 on Palin. It would be good if they could take a minute to inform us and suggest ways we can help those in need.
Obviously more concerned with politics than people in need.
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Kim,
The problem with younger women being screened is at least threefold: one, the purpose is largely so that they too can abort. Two, many people who find out they “might” be carrying a Down’s child abort a healthy child. Three, there is at least a 1 percent risk of miscarriage with amnio. So if you will carry the baby to term no matter the result, having an amnio and risking killing the child in the process is simply not worth it. My friends who have known the risk of amnio (doctors downplay it) have chosen not to have an amnio. As medical procedures go, it is a very risky one.
Scott, so nothing short of a legal requirement to abort would seem to you like too much pressure? C’mon, the doctor you trust tells you that you are foolish even to consider bearing this child, he pushes literature and videos with worst-case scenarios, he sends other doctors in to talk with you….You go back to work and confide in a colleague, and she immediately tells you that it would be cruel to bring such a child into the world. You aren’t sure that your insurance will cover everything, you’re sick with morning sickness, your husband tells you that if you do decide an abortion is best in this case he’ll understand, and the doctor calls back with more (unsolicited) information about how bad Down’s can be.
I’ve heard of doctors who refuse to keep a patient who goes “against medical advice” on this one. The pressure truly is enormous. It may not be a legal mandate, but so what–90% of mothers (including a huge number of pro-life mothers) abort. That alone says that the medical community is NOT telling these mothers that they’ll have the support they need, and that this is a precious child. If 90% of redheads were aborted, we’d think there was a doctor conspiracy against redheads. When 90% of any group is aborted, one pretty much has to think that doctors are urging and even pressuring women to abort, and women who have chosen to bear Down’s children say that is the case, that they have done so in spite of the anger and disapproval of the doctor.
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I do know woman who have been pressured to abort. I would have refused an amnio if it was only to screen. I had to have several to make sure my babies were viable. The risk would not have been worth it otherwise, IMO. Others certainly can choose differently. Some risks to the baby can be determined later in the pregnancy with different tools and then appropriate measures taken to help the baby.
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Scott, this is one of lamest sentences you could have written:
“So, then, NJL, what, we can never rely of the dictionary for anything?”
Every year new words and new meanings are added to dictionaries around the world.
“Urging does NOT equal insistence.” What? The way you leftys split hairs is unbelievable. When they split hairs over YOUR life, and they urge you to take the euthanasia pill because you’re no longer economically worth it, come back and we’ll talk.
And no, HRW, I didn’t say cancel the convention. I don’t know how the storm will play out. Who needs four days for a convention? I guess the Dems did because their platform is all smoke and mirrors. The storm, as of this writing is not going to be as strong as Katrina. No matter what. If they put the main speakers (and I hope that includes Lieberman) back to back, that would probably kick the Dems to the curb.
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Ah, NJL…. words… just what are they good for if you can’t rely on them to express your thoughts to distinguish the “finer” points of an argument? Ah, who needs those kind of details? ~eye roll~
It quickly brings to mind the way some Christians say that hate means love. God loves you and he is going to kill you at the end, if you don’t accept him. WOW, NOW I feel the love. I’m all tingly all over. just like my first kiss!
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“Tingly all over.” Like Chris Matthews when he hears Obama speak.
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