Comments on: Evangelicalism and hypocrisy http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/ A forum for discussion of news that arises at the intersection of Christianity and culture. Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:59:17 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: roger patno http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464839 roger patno Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:19:57 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464839 #21 The president does have the right to address school children, as any president has had. I believe that we should hear him and then, at that time we should judge without a closed mind , and then discuss it with our children. Compareing Mr. Obama to Hitler, and others? Perhaps they remember the continous trashing that Mr. Bush got from the left. I know, I know, that was then this is now. :-) Blessings Roger #21 The president does have the right to address school children, as any president has had. I believe that we should hear him and then, at that time we should judge without a closed mind , and then discuss it with our children. Compareing Mr. Obama to Hitler, and others? Perhaps they remember the continous trashing that Mr. Bush got from the left. I know, I know, that was then this is now. :-)
Blessings
Roger

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]]> By: rsd http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464671 rsd Mon, 07 Sep 2009 20:20:36 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464671 Moreover, it's not even clear what right-wing evangelicals want, other than to hear their own voices. Take, for example, the hissy-fit that conservative evangelicals are throwing over the President's planned speech to the nation's schoolchildren. I can't even understand what the "controversy" is. George HW Bush gave a similar speech with similar content in 1991. Why is the evangelical world reacting differently now than in 1991? The collective flip-out that's happening this weekend among conservative evangelicals simply smacks of hypocrisy. Is this really the reaction that one would expect from people who believe that Christ has secured victory over sin and death through the finished work of Christ? Besides, why are so many evangelicals quick to compare the President to Hitler, Stalin, and Kim Jong-Il? These kinds of statements only demonstrate that the speaker has no sense of moral judgment whatsoever. Christianity in the US suffers the misfortune of being the nation's folk religion. Thus, true Christ-centered Christianity must compete with the various strands of folk Christianity. Sometimes I wonder if we can ever untangle Christ from Branson, Missouri? Moreover, it’s not even clear what right-wing evangelicals want, other than to hear their own voices.

Take, for example, the hissy-fit that conservative evangelicals are throwing over the President’s planned speech to the nation’s schoolchildren.

I can’t even understand what the “controversy” is. George HW Bush gave a similar speech with similar content in 1991. Why is the evangelical world reacting differently now than in 1991? The collective flip-out that’s happening this weekend among conservative evangelicals simply smacks of hypocrisy.

Is this really the reaction that one would expect from people who believe that Christ has secured victory over sin and death through the finished work of Christ?

Besides, why are so many evangelicals quick to compare the President to Hitler, Stalin, and Kim Jong-Il? These kinds of statements only demonstrate that the speaker has no sense of moral judgment whatsoever.

Christianity in the US suffers the misfortune of being the nation’s folk religion. Thus, true Christ-centered Christianity must compete with the various strands of folk Christianity. Sometimes I wonder if we can ever untangle Christ from Branson, Missouri?

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]]> By: rsd http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464648 rsd Mon, 07 Sep 2009 19:32:23 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464648 "Evangelicalism is inherently a vain and misleading attempt to turn the society into the church. . . . It is a black hole of wasted energy for moral reform as we misrepresent the gospel in the process." Darryl Hart affirmed this statement in his recent interview with Mark Dever. Though one could quibble with Hart's bluntness, he has a point: The purpose of Christ's death and resurrection was not to initiate moral reform movements the likes of which we see from both right-wing and left-wing evangelicals. “Evangelicalism is inherently a vain and misleading attempt to turn the society into the church. . . . It is a black hole of wasted energy for moral reform as we misrepresent the gospel in the process.”

Darryl Hart affirmed this statement in his recent interview with Mark Dever. Though one could quibble with Hart’s bluntness, he has a point: The purpose of Christ’s death and resurrection was not to initiate moral reform movements the likes of which we see from both right-wing and left-wing evangelicals.

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]]> By: roger patno http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464631 roger patno Mon, 07 Sep 2009 19:05:25 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464631 Unortunatly, much Christian hypocrisy reveals itself in televangelism. Way to many sheep fleecers promising God's superabundant blessing if the viewer will simply 'Plant a generous "seed" offering into their ministry'. It shames me to see these things happen. They are a blot on the precious name of the Lord our provider. :-( Nevertheless He will ultimatly judge all things in righteouness. :-) Blessings Roger Unortunatly, much Christian hypocrisy reveals itself in televangelism. Way to many sheep fleecers promising God’s superabundant blessing if the viewer will simply ‘Plant a generous “seed” offering into their ministry’. It shames me to see these things happen. They are a blot on the precious name of the Lord our provider. :-(
Nevertheless He will ultimatly judge all things in righteouness. :-)
Blessings
Roger

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]]> By: 3545 http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464492 3545 Mon, 07 Sep 2009 15:20:16 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464492 The story above on the homeless shelter in Denver reminded me of an incident I thought would be more appropriate here. I used to volunteer at a Rescue Mission in Syracuse, NY, where we held a short worship service before a free meal for anyone. Occasionally I would give someone a ride afterwards. When I reminded one passenger to be sure and lock her door in bad neighborhood, she accused me of hypocrisy and immediately began to say something like - I thought you said that God will protect us. That's how easy it is to be accused when people delight in looking for double standards. But if it isn't one thing, it's another - big, small or concocted. The story above on the homeless shelter in Denver reminded me of an incident I thought would be more appropriate here. I used to volunteer at a Rescue Mission in Syracuse, NY, where we held a short worship service before a free meal for anyone. Occasionally I would give someone a ride afterwards. When I reminded one passenger to be sure and lock her door in bad neighborhood, she accused me of hypocrisy and immediately began to say something like – I thought you said that God will protect us. That’s how easy it is to be accused when people delight in looking for double standards. But if it isn’t one thing, it’s another – big, small or concocted.

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]]> By: roger patno http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464467 roger patno Mon, 07 Sep 2009 14:51:11 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464467 OH: We come to Christ as babes, grow into young men, and then fathers, as John addresses us in I John 2:12 FF. Where would you say, upon contemplating the passage, you are in your growth? I judge not, but I am trying to understand. Blessings Roger OH: We come to Christ as babes, grow into young men, and then fathers, as John addresses us in I John 2:12 FF. Where would you say, upon contemplating the passage, you are in your growth? I judge not, but I am trying to understand.
Blessings
Roger

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]]> By: Harris http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464200 Harris Sun, 06 Sep 2009 18:13:50 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464200 Sometimes we limit hypocrisy to a matter of truth claims, where we aver one thing and do another. Yet it seems to me there is also the no less damaging matter of the manner of one's life; this often is how I hear the secularists use "hypocrisy" when it comes to Christians. The secularist is less concerned with the words/deeds mismatch, as the words/character mismatch. Speech matters (or is that the speech coach talking? huh.) There is so much practical advice on this in Colossians, though I especially like Paul's counsel that we "season our speech with salt" (Col. 4.6). Sometimes we limit hypocrisy to a matter of truth claims, where we aver one thing and do another. Yet it seems to me there is also the no less damaging matter of the manner of one’s life; this often is how I hear the secularists use “hypocrisy” when it comes to Christians. The secularist is less concerned with the words/deeds mismatch, as the words/character mismatch. Speech matters (or is that the speech coach talking? huh.) There is so much practical advice on this in Colossians, though I especially like Paul’s counsel that we “season our speech with salt” (Col. 4.6).

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]]> By: Deet http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464164 Deet Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:21:03 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464164 Excellent piece, MICKEY. Perhaps this "state" of Evangelicalism is a result of 50 or 60 years of emphasizing "the personal": my personal relationship with Jesus Christ, my personal testimony. Even Sunday worship services seem to center around what we personally "get out of it" where we center more on ourselves (felt needs, preferences, how we feel about it all, etc.) rather than focusing on Christ and what He has done. I would disagree with VANESSAT is #11. I don't think it's EASY to "live an adultery free life" in our selfish, hyper-sexed culture that shamelessly promotes an insatiable obsession with our human passions. Excellent piece, MICKEY.

Perhaps this “state” of Evangelicalism is a result of 50 or 60 years of emphasizing “the personal”: my personal relationship with Jesus Christ, my personal testimony.

Even Sunday worship services seem to center around what we personally “get out of it” where we center more on ourselves (felt needs, preferences, how we feel about it all, etc.) rather than focusing on Christ and what He has done.

I would disagree with VANESSAT is #11. I don’t think it’s EASY to “live an adultery free life” in our selfish, hyper-sexed culture that shamelessly promotes an insatiable obsession with our human passions.

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]]> By: fisherman http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464162 fisherman Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:12:27 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464162 This is the paradox of the Christian life. We are new creations in Christ. Yet we have sin for which we need to ask forgiveness (for fellowship, not salvation). It is true that we ought not write "hypocrite" across our forehead. But, we must recognize that we have this awful tendency to both pretend and to act like what we are not. While God's powerful grace has made us like Christ, but we won't live out the fullness of that amazing blessing this side of Heaven. This is the paradox of the Christian life. We are new creations in Christ. Yet we have sin for which we need to ask forgiveness (for fellowship, not salvation). It is true that we ought not write “hypocrite” across our forehead. But, we must recognize that we have this awful tendency to both pretend and to act like what we are not. While God’s powerful grace has made us like Christ, but we won’t live out the fullness of that amazing blessing this side of Heaven.

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]]> By: hopesprings http://online.worldmag.com/2009/09/05/evangelicalism-and-hypocrisy/comment-page-1/#comment-464134 hopesprings Sun, 06 Sep 2009 12:03:42 +0000 http://online.worldmag.com/?p=22828#comment-464134 I tend to agree with Mytwosense. While we can recognize the commonality of our sinful tendencies i.e. the flesh, we now have a new identity in Christ and that new identity is not "Hypocrite". We have been "delivered from the power of darkness and have been translated into the Kingdom of His dear Son" (Col. 1:13),and, yet, we still label ourselves as hypocrites? The flesh will always be hypocritical. The flesh never changes or gets better. However, we have died with Christ to the sin of hypocrisy. If we find ourselves walking as hypocrites, chances are we are engaged in some kind of behavior that is contrary to our new identity in Christ i.e. "pretending to be what you are not". So, we repent, and walk in newness of life. :) (But, we don't need to remember to wear the hypocrite sign around our necks.) I tend to agree with Mytwosense. While we can recognize the commonality of our sinful tendencies i.e. the flesh, we now have a new identity in Christ and that new identity is not “Hypocrite”. We have been “delivered from the power of darkness and have been translated into the Kingdom of His dear Son” (Col. 1:13),and, yet, we still label ourselves as hypocrites? The flesh will always be hypocritical. The flesh never changes or gets better. However, we have died with Christ to the sin of hypocrisy. If we find ourselves walking as hypocrites, chances are we are engaged in some kind of behavior that is contrary to our new identity in Christ i.e. “pretending to be what you are not”. So, we repent, and walk in newness of life. :) (But, we don’t need to remember to wear the hypocrite sign around our necks.)

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